It’s our 10th Episode!!! We are stoked; thank you for your support! We decided to finally cover the stories in our theme song! Farz tells the incredible story of OJ Simpson. There’s stuff in here that even Taylor didn’t know! It’s a wild ride from the top of your game to accused murderer to memorabilia stealer to… just an old guy in Florida? You would never have guessed this if you knew OJ in the 70s. Taylor tried to do Jackie and JFK, but, we’ve all heard that. So, she went into the “Kennedy Curse” We don’t believe in curses, but we DO believe that rich people do stupid shit. Like flying their own airplanes, playing Ski Football, giving their children lobotomies, and lots of driving the under the influence with no consequences. Farz was visiting his fam in Dallas so his sound isn’t the best and we talk over each other a lot. We’re sorry. Follow us on Instagram & Facebook! @doomedtofailpod
It’s our 10th Episode!!! We are stoked; thank you for your support! We decided to finally cover the stories in our theme song!
Farz tells the incredible story of OJ Simpson. There’s stuff in here that even Taylor didn’t know! It’s a wild ride from the top of your game to accused murderer to memorabilia stealer to… just an old guy in Florida? You would never have guessed this if you knew OJ in the 70s.
Taylor tried to do Jackie and JFK, but, we’ve all heard that. So, she went into the “Kennedy Curse” We don’t believe in curses, but we DO believe that rich people do stupid shit. Like flying their own airplanes, playing Ski Football, giving their children lobotomies, and lots of driving the under the influence with no consequences.
Farz was visiting his fam in Dallas so his sound isn’t the best and we talk over each other a lot. We’re sorry.
Follow us on Instagram & Facebook! @doomedtofailpod
https://www.instagram.com/doomedtofailpod/
https://www.facebook.com/doomedtofailpod
Images of the Kennedys in happier times via the public domain
JFK Jr. on People from ABC News
OJ via public domain
Simpson family E News
OJ and Nicole from Today
Ron Goldman - a 90s stud - via NBC News
Hi Friends! Our transcripts aren't perfect, but I wanted to make sure you had something - if you'd like an edited transcript, I'd be happy to prioritize one for you - please email doomedtofailpod@gmail.com - Thanks! - Taylor
0:22
welcome to zoom to fail the podcast for me and Taylor seemingly keep missing
0:27
each other in Dallas um I'm pars I'm joined here by Taylor hi Taylor how are you I'm good how are you
0:36
I'm tired I just got to Dallas and I missed you by a day but here we are
0:43
but not on purpose it was I was trying to get out Thursday night and super annoying my plane got canceled
0:49
really late so luckily I have a friend that lives pretty close to the airport so I went and stayed with her I just like got to her house at midnight and
0:55
then like slept on a air mattress and then left at five to go back to the airport and I was on standby for an
1:02
eight o'clock flight back to California and luckily I got on it otherwise I would have been there like the rest of the day that's awful yeah that's so bad
1:09
yes I'm happy to be home yeah that's good to hear um we are going to be doing uh this is
1:15
our 10th episode which is a special 10th episode for us
1:20
I'm kind of proud of us for getting this far um yeah and you had a suggestion for what
1:28
we should do for our 10th episode you want to tell folks what that is yeah I thought to celebrate and it's so
1:35
funny because I feel like a lot of podcasts when they get to the like 100th episode they have a party and I'm like oh my God that feels so far away but
1:41
we're here at number 10 and I thought that we should do the relationships that
1:47
are in our theme song um farris's brother made it for us and it has two pretty famous
1:54
um stories in it so we thought we'd head over to those love it you're going first I'm going
1:59
first what what's wrong with your drink okay I'm gonna try to do this my drink is a Sam Adams because it's a nice
2:05
Boston Lager I do lost in laga just nailed that accent
2:11
Boston I don't have that
2:16
all I have is a stone ipas I'm gonna drink that right now but um that sounds so good come on let me see my parents but I only
2:24
have one beer I think oh no I have Bud Lights because whenever my dad visits he leaves a trail
2:30
but like lunch comes to rest I can always have a bed light no just regular ones oh man
2:37
there's no beer okay so much for that my drink
2:43
is a screwdriver because I am covering Oriental James
2:49
Simpson and I feel like I feel like if you're married to him you
2:55
gotta be drunk on screwdrivers you got to pour some vodka in the OJ to maintain
3:01
that marriage for any bit of time it's hilarious I love it it's real good also
3:07
I'm totally aware that my audio quality is going backwards this week and it is just because I'm traveling
3:13
that's okay yeah so let's go ahead and Dive Right In so I'm gonna start with my
3:20
side of the the true true crime side of things with O.J Simpson by saying that this story has been
3:28
covered to death but in researching this episode so many things came up that I just forgotten about or never really
3:34
knew some of our listeners like ourselves were old enough to remember watching the
3:40
white Bronco Chase if that is you then you already probably know the broad Strokes of what happened
3:46
here but we're gonna go into it anyways if you're too young to remember in addition to this podcast I would
3:52
recommend checking out the people versus O.J Simpson on Netflix Taylor have you seen that I have it's up
3:59
by the American it's American Crime Story right or is it the documentary
4:05
uh this this is not the documentary this one's the 10 part series
4:10
um that really just starts with the murders and ends with the verdict Cuba Gooding juniors in it he does an incredible job as OJ and if you remember
4:17
John Travolta plays Robert slash Bob Shapiro I do remember that there it is and Sarah
4:24
Paulson is in it too she's the the other lawyer that's great
4:30
um martial arts yeah she's so good so obviously this is you know it is sad
4:38
spoil alert two people lost their lives Nicole Brown and Ronald Goldman were the two victims and obviously it's a tragedy
4:45
and all that all that but the one thing I would say is that it's gonna sound really weird when I started
4:50
researching this I thought of Rambo for some reason and we
4:56
what I think I was really focused on there was that there are some things historically that produce amazing stuff
5:03
as a result of it so for example I was thinking about I started going on this path of thinking
5:08
about Vietnam and how Rambo the character is really a byproduct like it wouldn't exist but for Vietnam and I
5:15
started researching what are some other things that were a byproduct of that war and Hendrix Zappa Dylan all these amazing
5:23
iconic musicians were completely influenced by that war
5:29
and certainly that can I get a hot take yeah Bob Dylan is terrible his
5:35
song lyrics are like a five-year-old wrote them like it's like he Rhymes words like bird nerd
5:42
and like that's it that's it he's like not it's really really bad and I saw him in person like 15
5:49
years ago and even then he was too old to be performing and it was just like
5:55
oh geez anyway I believe it I'm not impressed yeah I'm not like uh a fanboy
6:00
of Bob Dylan um I will argue that Hendrix is amazing but you didn't respond to him
6:07
I said nothing about that yeah circling back the topic of today within this event I went on Amazon and I looked up
6:15
the books category and searched for O.J Simpson there were 16 books per page result
6:24
returned by Amazon and there were 39 pages oh my gosh it said 16 I was like there
6:31
has to be more than 16 and there's like all sorts of sports 624 books on Amazon right now that you
6:38
can read about the O.J Simpson trial that doesn't include this is what I feel like yeah go ahead no I'm gonna say like
6:44
this is what I feel like when people are like oh you're starting a podcast everyone has a podcast I'm like yeah everyone also has a book by O.J Simpson
6:52
this does not include anthologies it just include O.J Simpson in it like spouse killer like all that none of that
6:59
other True Crime so that's not included in this this is literally just about the trial and actually every character that
7:06
we're going to discuss here has written at least one book on it including the
7:11
prosecutors the attorney all of them and then in addition that I went and found there were 20 songs written that
7:17
referenced the killings they're fine like shitty movies they came out
7:22
immediately after this case became a thing uh not including the Netflix
7:27
series I just mentioned or the three movies that O.J Simpson himself starred in the TV prank show that he produced so
7:33
like there's a ton of content that came out of this this uh case one thing I read that isn't
7:42
here that I didn't list here but is 100 believe it is that the night of the
7:47
murderer somebody already started trying to sell the book rights to a publisher the the
7:54
actual night that they found out that this happened somebody tried to actually capitalize on it [ __ ] yeah good for that
8:00
person because I know good for them too yeah yeah and one thing we can thank this
8:07
case on is giving us the Kardashian family really I'm not a Kardashian I don't really care sure I'm happy for
8:14
them they're doing great they're doing their own thing whatever I'm sure people have feelings about it but Tim's Kim Kardashian's dad her father
8:22
Rob was one of OJ's defense attorneys in a really really close friend of his
8:27
we'll get into like how close they actually ended up being and he was also like hilariously played
8:32
by David Schwimmer in the Netflix series he's just always I don't know what it is about David schwart but he just always
8:37
looks confused yeah you felt so bad for that man
8:45
who rob yeah yeah he was just so sad he just like was like this is my best friend he couldn't have killed someone and then he was like I'm sure they
8:52
intentionally did this but they had him like with his kids and being like it's more important to be a good person than to be rich and you know of course like
8:58
after he died his family like did their thing so it's funny don't you feel like that was editorialized just to like poke
9:04
fun at the Kardashians it totally was okay absolutely but it was hilarious yes yes yeah so long story short is that
9:12
there are millions of cultural touchstones that come out of this event
9:17
we're gonna just start by getting into the main characters here curious to know your take on this so you're you would
9:24
have been of an age you watched this right like you I'm assuming you kept up with this okay was was O.J Simpson a name you would
9:33
recognize before this happened I only not as like
9:38
anything else and I don't know I don't know if it's before or after but there's this movie that we used to watch when I
9:44
was little within the Funicello from The Mickey Mouse Club where she's older and it's called back to the beach and it's
9:50
like her and her family Lori Laughlin is in it it's like very bizarre um but I used to watch it all the time with my
9:55
family and in that movie they're at the airport and they see OJ Simpson and they say is that odia Simpson but then they
10:01
see he like runs and trips over a bunch of suitcases and they're like oh no it can't be they're actually something I
10:07
don't know it's like a totally random cultural point but um so I might have known like of him
10:14
because of that or that but like not like a lot like we weren't like Bills fans so yeah I might have been too young
10:20
but the name OJ Simpson meant absolutely nothing to me before this all happened
10:26
but apparently I mean people treated this guy like uh
10:31
Messiah almost there's a funny story yes debunked now about how James Cameron
10:36
originally cast OJ as the Terminator in the movies Arnold Schwarzenegger has said that OJ wasn't believable as a
10:43
killing machine so they recast the role for him all this isn't true so James Cameron actually has relatively recently
10:50
I read an article that James hearing came out and said no this was literally just one phone call some executive who was on the production company side of
10:56
things called James Cameron and said hey we recommend you cast OJ in this role
11:01
wasn't true but obviously his name was big enough to where it's being battered around in Hollywood hallways to the
11:07
likes of a James Cameron right so he was like a cultural phenomenon yeah yeah he was like one of
11:15
the first football like Superstars because I feel like before there's like a lot of terrible stories about men who
11:21
were like in football in the 60s who didn't get paid a lot in the NFL and now
11:26
have terrible brain diseases or brain injuries and people are like oh but you
11:32
were in the NFL and they're like it wasn't like that it wasn't like I was a superstar all these endorsements it was like kind of like a regular job you know
11:38
yeah so you didn't get paid this extraordinary amount so he was like one of the first I think he did all those parts endorsements right the hurt cars
11:45
he was just like I think maybe the first really really really famous one especially the first black one I think
11:51
like as a black man being super uber famous you are nailing everything here
11:59
that is a really good encapsulation uh again I wasn't aware no no I wasn't
12:05
aware of any like I I'm gonna get into it but like that was actually a really
12:10
good way to phrase it so going back to the characters the main characters of the story we have orenthal James Simpson
12:16
oh James self who was a former professional football player and an actor we have Nicole Brown Simpson
12:21
um she has no work history to speak of really her and OJ met when she was a waitress at 18 years old and we have
12:28
Ronald Lyle Goldman who was a waiter who had the misfortune of being friends with Nicole
12:34
I think some sort of relationship with her like I don't I we don't know but whatever doesn't matter right yeah I agree I'll start by
12:41
saying I love football but America's hero worship of football is kind of insane
12:47
there is no doubt OJ was a phenomenal athlete but this guy's hero status got
12:54
him into and out of so many things that are completely closed off to normal human beings
13:00
I mean think about it it's literally the reason why we know his name I mean murdering spouses is nothing new and yet
13:06
this guy has been dominating the public Consciousness for almost 30 years now I'm gonna go I'm gonna list off OJ's
13:15
Achievements not because they're meaningful to me or probably really the listeners either but it helps me in a
13:20
picture of just how respected this guy was at that time these are just bullet points I'm gonna rattle off he played
13:27
for USC when and when he graduated they retired his jersey for context this actually only happened six times so
13:33
there's only six players including OJ in Trojan history ever had their numbers retired he won All-American twice in
13:40
college he won the Heisman Trophy he was basically in every what is essentially now the Pro Bowl of his era back then
13:48
was called the all-time teams he had the most touchdowns in 1975 the
13:53
most rushing touchdowns in 73 and 75 the most rushing yards for Four Seasons he
13:59
won the offensive player of the year three times the Associated Press named him athlete of the year in 1973. once
14:06
they started actually having Pro bowls and naming it that he played in five of them
14:11
he won offensive player of the year in 73 and he won the NFL most valuable
14:16
player in 73 as well what a year
14:26
all right but she actually was that exceptional like his player's stats are way too
14:34
boring to go into again tons of hero worship here but if you want to you can go and look on his Wikipedia page and
14:40
somebody has meticulously gone through every year everything he did every game he played in noted all of it it I mean
14:47
even if you don't get to the murders it's like 50 pages of content just by going off of that stuff I would say that
14:53
every publication I looked at listed him on the top 50 best players in the
14:58
history of football bleach your report which is probably one of the more respected you know content
15:04
creators on the on the sports front actually hasn't listed number 16 all time which is actually ahead of Tom
15:11
Brady that's the status of person that we're talking about here I don't know why I feel I said good to that but like
15:17
I feel like I feel equally unimpressed with Tom Brady as I do with OJ Simpson even though he has
15:22
not killed anyone and I hope he never does I think I think you're just over Boston in New England people after your
15:30
research this week for real that's enough of his NFL stats OJ always also
15:38
had a passion for acting he actually started doing bit parts and shows while he was still in college at USC his most
15:44
famous roles were obviously the Naked Gun movies which are amazing people should go watch those
15:49
he also hosted SNL he was a com he was a commentator for the NFL on NBC and as
15:56
you had actually mentioned earlier he was also a spokesperson for Hertz the rental car company Ochi was actually
16:02
kind of shrewd when it comes to business he knew like exactly what you just said
16:07
Taylor he knew he had the ID factor that it invaded black athletes for most of
16:12
sports history White America saw OJ as just this non-threatening very awful
16:19
good-looking Charming guy ironically he also had he never had scandals and like
16:26
I said before he literally won every single award that existed totally so he had a ton of endorsement deals um
16:33
he had allocated resources from his football you know times making money
16:39
doing football to buying hotels buying restaurants outside of football he was
16:44
making about one million dollars per year which converted to today's money is about 2.1 million dollars that's away
16:50
from football that is literally just endorsements side hustle businesses that he had like I said O.J Nicole met and
16:55
started dating when she was 18 and he was actually still married to a woman named Marguerite whom she had three kids
17:01
with two years later in 1979 O.J Marguerite divorced and he would eventually marry
17:07
Nicole in 1985. so by my count that puts Nicole at 26 in him at 37 years old when
17:14
they get married yeah so at this point he'd retire by the way at this point
17:19
he'd retired so at this point by the time he marries Nicole he's lived a
17:24
complete life I mean everything he just listed off that he did that happened five years before this marriage came
17:31
about he marries Nicole and as he's as she's involved in his life he is
17:37
ramping up to the next round of being this successful actor spokesperson
17:43
multiple business owner all the rest of it I'd imagine if we would have played like
17:49
Simpson instead of Madden played OJ yeah imagine if like he had been mad and like
17:54
made the game and like had not done anything bad like he could have just like done some anymore things I thought about that so many times
18:00
because the way this guy's life derails after this case we'll get into that talk about like
18:08
complete 180 right from the most actual Charming non-offensive non-skandal
18:14
person to like anyways we know who he is now right okay like we always say we're
18:20
the only podcast advocating not to kill your family and those are consequences nothing good happens nothing you turn
18:25
into OJ yeah yeah so I don't know how smart I think OJ or Nicole are in comparison to one
18:32
another but still I mean I would be intimidated by his success like never
18:37
mind a 26 year old I mean think about this guy's like going to he knows everybody everybody who's everybody who's rich famous powerful in Hollywood
18:44
knows your husband and like it's very very close and wants him to like them that's the status that we're talking
18:50
about here that's the power Dynamic we always talk about yeah yeah and again this one goes
18:56
so much deeper so I wrote here that yeah sure there's the power Dynamic that we always talk about 11 year age difference
19:01
wealth so on all the other stuff but it's also different because there's a cultural Dynamic at play here
19:07
if you're Nicole you don't just have a husband in O.J Simpson you have a national hero like literally Mr
19:14
All-American like who will ever care about the faults that you have with this
19:21
person whether they're abusive or not like how could you have any issues with with your baby he's Untouchable yeah
19:30
they're married in 85 they have two kids together which we never talk about thankfully like I'm researching this you
19:38
never hear about the kids ever there's one part of this story where you hear about the kids and I literally had to do when the police called OJ to tell him
19:45
that Nicole was dead and you're just like how are the kids that's the only time they really come up so
19:50
kudos to the media for a change for not being horrible about the situation with
19:56
them but poor kids right yeah poor babies yeah there were obviously claims
20:01
of spousal abuse one claim in 1989 actually went to court in total there
20:08
were 62 incidences of abuse of which Nicole actually only reported eight
20:14
mostly this was because she was 100 financially dependent on OJ part of their marriage included a prenuptial
20:20
agreement part of that prenuptial agreement they included a stipulation that said that she's like legally not
20:26
allowed to take on employment she was 100 dependent on OJ that's part
20:31
of why they think that she never I mean again only one of those one of those situations actually went to trial there
20:38
were many stories that were told about I mean this was a classic I fell on the doorknob story right so she she always
20:45
made excuses for him Nicole you're gonna talk about the 911 calls have you heard them from her I have heard the 911 calls
20:51
but I didn't actually include them in this outline do you want to talk about them well just the one that I heard is he was
20:57
like beating her up and she was calling the police and she'd called them probably several times and she like told
21:03
them her address and they were like she's like my husband like he's hitting me and they were like who's your husband and she was like you know who it is it's
21:10
O.J Simpson you know she was very like you know who this is like stop trying to
21:15
like make me say it she's like you know he's not on stop making him Untouchable
21:20
you know who it is you know so it sounds like she I mean I'm sure that there were like
21:26
you said like tons of times where she didn't call anyone because also like who would believe her maybe or like who wants to
21:32
get into that who want you don't want to like step into that puddle yeah it's so it's so Hollywood to me because
21:38
everybody's such a gripper and they're all trying to saddle up to power which
21:45
is just the dynamic of people in Hollywood yeah and so why would you go against OJ like that's I mean outside of
21:53
moral obligations obviously but to Nicole's credit she did finally file
21:59
for divorce she cited irreconcilable differences they apparently tried getting back together that obviously
22:04
didn't work out and the divorce was finalized some somewhere in in 1992 let's get into the crime itself I'll
22:12
start by saying that OJ was obviously acquitted of the murders in Criminal Court he was however found guilty of
22:18
wrongful death when he was sued in Civil Court not going super into the procedural side of things but in
22:23
criminal Accord the burden of proof is beyond a reasonable doubt in Civil Court it is much lower it is preponderance of
22:28
the evidence hence why the results are different all that being said OJ did it like we all know that right yeah I was
22:35
gonna say after that but but he did it I do have a fun conspiracy theory that I'd like to share with you later
22:40
um but no he hundred percented it yeah I'm calling I'm calling that an indisputable fact yes so on June 12th of
22:48
1994 this would be two years after the divorce OJ and Nicole attended the recital of their daughter after which
22:54
they parted the ways Nicole went to a restaurant with her family a restaurant where Ronald Goldman was a waiter side
23:02
note I kind of hate how much I love the characters here it is this is such an LA
23:08
Story I'm bringing that up because as a research this I remembered Cato Kalin do you remember him I was just thinking I
23:13
was like characters I was like Cato yes oh my God totally he's incredible he
23:19
lived in OJ's like guest house some burnt out actor anyways uh so in this on this night
23:27
while Nicole is having dinner with her family OJ was getting McDonald's take out with Cato at some point in the night
23:33
OJ's uh sorry at some point in the night Nicole's mom calls the restaurant they ate at and told them that she was
23:39
missing her classes the manager found the glasses and apparently Ron was
23:44
supposed to go to Nicole's house to return them that was the game plan around 11 p.m on that night a man in
23:50
Nicole's neighborhood was out for a stroll when Nicole's dog came up to him covered in blood apparently yeah
23:57
apparently this guy didn't find that suspicious he just like walked home and the dog followed him eventually one of
24:03
the neighbors some couple said hey I'll take the dog in the guy didn't want to hold on to it then he was Nicole's and
24:08
then they went back to the house to Nicole's place to return the dog and naturally discovered her body so she had been stabbed to death apparently she was
24:16
nearly decapitated it was a pretty gruesome scene yeah that's what I heard Ron's body was yeah Ron's body was found
24:24
nearby and had also been stabbed multiple times it was assumed that OJ was killing
24:30
Nicole when Ron showed up and he took Ron out basically to avoid Witnesses at the scene police found a blue cap and a
24:38
leather glove which will come up very famously later on the night all this went down OJ was actually supposed to be
24:44
flying to Chicago to meet with Hertz Executives a limo driver arrived at his
24:49
house and waited for him until sometime around 10 40 PM or so to take him to the airport
24:55
apparently the limo driver stated that he loaded four pieces pieces of luggage in the car
25:00
but OJ only flew with three so the Assumption was that he went to LAX and
25:05
he took a piece of luggage with him that hadn't come in any evidence and just disposed of it there in the public bins
25:11
police call OJ in Chicago the next day to tell him about Nicole's death he
25:17
sounded upset but like I said he was mostly disinterested um according to what's being reported was reported first is that normal like
25:24
if would someone call like your ex-wife if you were murdered no right that is weird like why would they call him like
25:31
I just probably because he's famous I guess and they wanted to talk to O.J Simpson but like that feels really weird I feel like
25:37
why would you call someone's ex if they were murdered you would call like anyone
25:42
else well well what I what I can guess is that the kids were in the house when
25:47
she was killed and so maybe oh yeah yeah as a parent okay that makes sense because the parent and the poor kids oh
25:54
poor babies okay yeah that's the only thing I can imagine they ended up asking
25:59
him to come in for questioning which he did and he was caught immediately lying immediately like the first thing coming
26:05
out of his mouth he like he's such a dope well also I think that he's also
26:11
probably like in shock about what he did maybe to an extent uh but he he lies
26:16
about a cut on his hand and he says that he got it in Chicago like yeah like he said that like he was so stunned when he
26:22
heard the news but they found like Blood Prince in his vehicle and like and then he was like Oh no I got it the day before I left for Chicago I forgot like
26:29
it was like why what a weird thing to lie about before you said that his hand they had a cut in his hand I was
26:35
thinking like his hand would hurt because I remember in like this is gross but I remember in the Manson Murders one
26:41
of the girls that had was like stabbing Abigail folder to death was like I was surprised how much my hand
26:46
hurt because yeah isn't that easy to almost decapitate someone you know like what a he just did something so
26:54
traumatic you know you can't I don't know but like also remember too like
26:59
he's like a super athlete but he's not a normal weight lifter no I know but
27:06
that's like a different it's a different muscle to do but just stabbing I guess
27:12
I don't know okay you guys the next day after O.J comes back from
27:19
Chicago goes to talk to the police he hires Rob Shapiro who's a lawyer basically tasked with assembling a
27:25
defense team for him they call this defense team the Dream Team he hired a who's who of the most expensive lawyers
27:30
in Los Angeles they all became ancillary characters in their own right it was reported during this time OJ was very
27:37
very distraught and super depressed he actually went and stayed at Rob Kardashian's house with him and his
27:43
family for several days for the moral support I would assume on June and in
27:49
the in the in the show they make it clear that when he did that
27:54
he had a girlfriend yeah do you remember that yeah that's just that's bananas yeah Barbara area or something yeah she
28:02
became um I don't remember so what the fat woman had to like share a bed with him at the Kardashians
28:09
so well I mean give me a break that's terrifying there's one one piece of this which like
28:16
OJ apparently had a bunch of naked pictures of this girlfriend up at his house and the jury went to his house to
28:22
like look at the scene of him being at the house or whatever and apparently uh
28:28
Johnny Cochran and Rob Kardashian went to the house and replaced all the naked pictures of this woman that he was
28:33
dating with like was it it was uh who's that artist that's Norman Rockwell they placed all
28:40
these yeah right so funny on June 17th the LAPD concludes
28:47
that they have enough and they asked OJ to surrender himself they ask him ask him to surrender himself like that's
28:53
what we're talking about here right they would go get him yeah
29:00
they this actually is like a huge part of the Netflix series is like this Saga of getting OJ to the police station
29:08
they the police tell Shapiro this who then relayed this to OJ at this point
29:14
former formal murder charges have been followed by the state because somehow I
29:20
don't I don't know maybe it's a fame maybe it's really good Loring but his lawyers keep delaying him going to the
29:27
police station to surrender himself up to a point the LAPD eventually has enough and they just go to the
29:33
Kardashian house to arrest anxiety this is enough finally by this point OJ and his friend and
29:40
former teammate Al cowling she will refer to here going forward is AC had apparently disappeared from the
29:46
Kardashian house and an APB was put out for both of them for their arrest as fugitives
29:52
hours after The Disappearance Rob finds a suicide letter from OJ which okay like
30:00
I get it suicide sucks this one was so what was me like it's the ramblings of somebody incredibly
30:07
privileged and not understanding how badly he [ __ ] everything up he just really felt sorry for himself going to
30:14
the Bronco chase the famous famous Bronco chase this was such a big deal if
30:20
you're old enough to remember this yes I remember for sure yeah like they
30:27
the details of it like rereading I was like oh my I can't believe this they interrupted an NBA Finals game just to
30:33
air this I remember when this happened my parents were having a party at our house and we all everybody literally
30:40
stopped everything to go watch this Chase it also reminded me of like again how La this is I mean you remember this
30:46
when you lived in La like it was a past time to watch car chases it was just like it was like yeah oh my gosh there's
30:51
so many that was really funny I just someone at my office who were talking about it recently and she was born that
30:58
day in Inglewood and I was just like oh my God your mom must have been like what are the doctors doing they're not here
31:05
helping me you know that's wild there are so many details here some of the fun
31:11
ones are that what the way they got to OJ during this
31:18
car chase was they would have all these people go on the news
31:23
and start talking like they're talking to OJ but it's being broadcast across the entire country right
31:29
um they would have his coaches all these famous friends he had these former famous teammates and players all of them
31:35
would go on news shows and literally be talking to OJ on the radio apparently yeah
31:43
apparently he had a gun on him as well AC calls us out and says hey he's got a gun he's basically sitting in the back
31:48
seat he was wailing about Nicole about how he's ruined his life just every indicator of how guilty this man
31:54
actually is this thing I made a mistake I should not have killed someone yeah basically that
32:00
so this thing drags on for hours apparently the police helicopter had to stop and go back and refuel like that's
32:05
how long this was this was taking off but this this wasn't like a high-speed thing it was just like this Meandering around the one it was so slow yeah it
32:13
totally was eventually AC and OJ make it back to his estate and he goes in the
32:20
house for about an hour before Rob Shapiro arrives or Bob Square arrives
32:25
and escorts him out to be arrested finally being the pre-trial side of things OJ pled not guilty obviously and
32:32
a trial was set for January 24th 1995. they really harped on the fact that he really wanted an expedited trial for
32:39
some reason I'm not entirely sure why he was so in in need of that maybe he'll just go back get back to normal life let
32:45
me get acquitted and move on I love how literally everyone in this
32:50
trial became their own celebrities just by association yeah
32:56
well was it the first trial that was on TV or was that Menendez brothers it was like one of the two right
33:02
so I thought the McMartin thing was first this was that preschool yeah I
33:09
don't know yeah that's one of the first I guess it had to be one of the first uh judge so
33:15
for example the judge in this case Lance Ito he was lampooned on SNL
33:21
Marsha Clark oh yeah I remember that yeah the dancing needles so at Marcia Clark she was the lead
33:28
prosecutor she became a television personality who basically now reports on
33:33
legal matters OJ's own defense team became superstars in their own right I don't know if you know this but Bob
33:39
Shapiro became like the face and founder of um LegalZoom oh that's funny the
33:45
founder well they built him as a Founder I'm sure he was I'm sure the the actual technical founder really needed like a
33:51
famous lawyer to like attach it to but yeah that's how he's built that's hilarious I love it he's still
33:57
alive is he dead I don't know I know that I know that um I know that I mean it's sad like so many
34:05
of his lawyers died like weird tragic deaths like Rob Kardashian famously died pretty soon after this trial and so did
34:12
Johnny Cochran actually yeah uh so going into the trial side of it it would be tough to discuss this without discussing
34:17
race this murder in the trial happened two to three years after the LA riots happened
34:24
which were sparked by the LAPD beating the [ __ ] out of a black band named
34:31
Rodney King obviously things like this but the LA Riot don't happen overnight
34:36
this was a powder keg just waiting to explode for years it was obvious that racial
34:42
tensions in La were on the rise and the police just weren't helping anything there's video of Rodney King's beating
34:50
that everyone saw and this is the part that I didn't remember that came up as I was doing the
34:55
research but the officers were responsible were tried and the jury was
35:00
mostly Wayne they were all acquitted so that's actually what started the riots which I didn't actually remember any of this OJ I remember I've seen the video I
35:08
remember that it's awful yeah OJ was obviously a very prominent
35:13
very successful black man Nicole and Ron were both White
35:18
there was an obvious racial divide and a racial tension in the city at the time
35:24
interestingly both the prosecution and the defense had a very similar strategy
35:29
regarding who they wanted on the jury but for very very different reasons so the prosecution wanted women because
35:37
they assumed that domestic the domestic violence component of this would resonate with them the defense
35:44
also wanted women but they were very specific they wanted only black women because their research showed that black
35:50
women disproportionately disapprove of interracial marriages the jury ended up
35:55
being 10 women two men nine were black two were white and there was one
36:00
Hispanic man which you know given how this trial played out they
36:08
were the defense was right I think yeah so the reason I say that it is almost
36:15
impossible to believe he did not do this here's an example of some of the
36:21
evidence that they had outside of the circumstantial stuff of like he disappeared in a car chase tried to kill
36:28
himself was wailing about like all these stuff that make it popsy like obvious
36:33
that he did it but the innocent people don't do that clever right
36:39
beyond beyond that and and this works really I'll harp on this here in a minute but uh his DNA was
36:45
identified near the bodies of the crime scene his blood was left as a trail leaving the crime scene the blood of him
36:52
Nicole and Ron were in the white Bronco there's like eight more of these yeah
36:58
yeah I'm not like I'm barely scratching the surface how much forensic evidence and DNA evidence that was here but I
37:04
will also say that this was one of the first trials where DNA was being introduced as a mechanism of matching
37:11
people to crime scenes so there is a part of me that thinks
37:16
that well maybe the jury just wasn't properly educated on how rare it is to have mistaken DNA
37:23
it was so new yeah I feel like now I've seen like 7
37:29
000 episodes of Bones where I'm like oh the DNA is like a hard truth you know I but if you don't if we hadn't
37:36
like we hadn't really heard of it yet that's true and then I also wrote down that this is a jury pool of citizens who
37:44
regularly see the police just doing messed up things to prove minorities guilty right
37:50
so yeah that's true yeah so maybe they were educated on this and it's they still dismissed it's like I'm not going
37:56
to believe the cops that like I think they're like a really racist cop involved in this ah we're gonna get some
38:02
we're gonna get to them okay like more racist than most yeah he was he was phenomenally racist
38:09
yes right among the among the police yes I think
38:16
it's like the next paragraph or two paragraph um okay so this argument about the
38:23
police doing Shady things is actually the route the defense took themselves they said the lap PD basically botched
38:30
this either deliberately or accidentally mm-hmm there's a ton of back and forth
38:36
on this I read all of this stuff and if we went over it Point by Point you'd literally just pass out listening to
38:42
this there was do you think that you should start a Judicial you should start to do just a little judicial procedures
38:48
podcast there's parts for this interest there's portion that's like yeah I I am kind of
38:55
a nerd when it comes to that stuff but I think I'm rare but in this case there was issues with
39:02
how they preserve the DNA evidence there were discrepancies on how much blood there was where it was when it was there
39:08
there are claims of mishandling evidence yeah this drones on
39:13
basically the defense poked holes in every part of the prosecution's case I
39:20
mean frankly because they could afford to do so most people don't have that luxury right like you come with a theory
39:25
and then you try and argue that theory to counter the prosecution in this case they had whatever however much money
39:31
they needed so they could literally just spend all their time finding ways to poke holes in everything hiring every
39:37
expert they could to poke holes in every detail of the prosecution's case I just as far as I just looked it up but I was
39:43
looking up so Robert Shapiro is still alive I just looked it up he's 80 years old
39:48
um but he oh but in reading that I saw a little paragraph that the Dream Team
39:54
cost fifty thousand dollars a day I think the total yeah I think the total I looked up was it was somewhere around
39:59
3.5 to 6 million dollars how much OJ ended up spending for his entire defense it's crazy yeah that's in that's hold on
40:06
that that would have been a 90 for money yeah so that would have been like probably look it up yeah could you
40:14
um I'm so sorry I'm doing this wrong three I'm gonna guess no it had to be it had to be like seven
40:21
so if you're doing 3.5 I I would assume it would have to be somewhere around seven to eight million yeah I think it's
40:28
like seven and that's almost yeah yeah so like if he so so if you do
40:34
that conversion for like the tie range of that the Six Million you're looking like a 12 million dollar defense it's crazy yeah
40:41
um was it worth it you lived the rest of your life as a prior like is it is it really maybe it is I don't know well
40:47
what are you gonna do go to jail I mean I guess it could have been like the coolest guy in jail I guess I don't
40:53
know I don't know did you know whatever can keep going so many opinions about OJ I tried to
41:00
find his Instagram because apparently he got on Instagram and I think that the ones I found are some big fakes so um to
41:06
your point Mr incredibly famous
41:12
LAPD racist we're getting to Mark Furman
41:17
for sure so a little background on Mark like I said he was an LAPD police officer and
41:24
he was one of the very first officers at the scene of OJ's estate in 1985 so nine years before the murder
41:33
I mean this is Taylor this is the stuff that I started looking at I was like I totally forgot to sort of thing I mean and this guy I didn't even know this was
41:39
a thing so nine years before the murders a screenwriter named boar McKinney
41:44
wanted to write a screenplay about the experiences of female officers she met
41:50
Mark and asked that he provide Consulting Services about his experience as a police officer working with women
41:56
in the town in the police force and all that good stuff like we have been said
42:02
Mark sucks Mark is what a stupid person thinks a
42:09
man's man is yes he is the definition of punching down
42:15
and feeling good for doing so Laura recorded all these conversations she had
42:21
with him and amongst the amazing character traits that Mark exhibited these are the beliefs that he yelled
42:28
he was a leader in a group called m-a-w Ma which stands for men against women
42:35
which literally sounds like Al Bundy created it like this sounds like it's so stupid that is a that's it just sounds
42:43
dumb you sometimes they can't think of a worse name
42:49
did it I I could have sworn this is a part of Married With Children right it
42:54
might be oh my God whatever it does sound like that yeah the whole point of this was this is a group of male police
43:01
officers who would harass and intimidate female LAPD officers like they would put them In Harm's Way so for example if
43:06
like the female officer is in a shootout didn't ask for a backup they just won't
43:11
show like it was it was crazy levels of just trying to make these women's lives
43:17
a living hell and this was a big group I didn't write the exact number down but it was somewhere like 140 I think if I
43:22
remember correctly was the number of LA PD Officers that were part of this organization or organization a bunch of
43:29
[ __ ] morons just hanging around um men against women like what does it even mean like what no do you like
43:44
are you going uh so he obviously said a ton of misogynistic things on these
43:50
tapes and I won't go into them except one thing which was he he was quoted as
43:56
saying you've got to be able to shoot people be people beyond recognition and
44:01
go home and hug your little kids women don't pack those qualities which good
44:07
you shouldn't think that eating someone's beyond recognition is a good thing like why you're an office why are
44:13
you doing that you're not the jury you're not the judge you're not the institution that is meant to punish these people like you should be just
44:19
taking them and putting them in the places where they can be prosecuted like why are you being someone beyond recognition do you think I know that
44:25
like we said earlier that you were talking about you know you're not against the police but I do think that
44:31
a lot of police reform wouldn't hurt you know and like there's kind of it's
44:38
always been the case yeah yeah so um little sensitivity training yeah so what happened
44:45
so much happened in La LAPD police force because of this trial because all this stuff came out right like all like there
44:52
was investigations and oh wait are y'all really not showing up as backup for women like
44:57
a lot of the reforms came as a downstream impact of this case there was another Scandal that happened called
45:03
Rampart which I'm not going to get into but there was multiple dominoes that fell because of this which were great
45:09
they were there were great dominoes to fall they should fall yeah good [ __ ] those guys yeah yeah totally
45:14
um mark was recorded on this saying the n-word
45:19
41 times on the tape which is I think was happening yeah this
45:26
this is actually really important this is a critical part of this case and it comes up later on in the trial
45:33
because Marcus asked if he has ever said that word and he testifies he perjures
45:39
himself saying no he hasn't so this is going to come up later on and is a big part of the defense's case actually
45:45
again the reason why all this is relevant is because of the crime scene where they found Nicole in Ron's body
45:51
there was a bloody glove that was also found there at OJ's estate there was another pair
45:58
that was found by Mark the defense states that Mark planted the
46:04
glove because of his racial animals that's why all this kind of ties together right the defense said that
46:09
Mark found the glove at the crime scene and then took it back to OJ's house
46:14
so we've concluded here that Mark sucks
46:19
right Taylor he's not smart enough to do that right that's what I'm getting at like as she
46:26
doesn't have a human as he is this almost certainly did not happen but part
46:32
of the reason why it's so obvious that this did not happen despite his horrible horrible character flaws is it the crime
46:39
scene was combed over for about two hours before Mark actually arrived at it
46:44
and nobody there ever said anything about seeing a second Club they only saw the one that's
46:51
hole in this in this defense the prosecution famously asked OJ to try on the glove to
46:58
show that it fits him OJ probably was making a display of how hard it was I mean there's video that you can watch
47:04
this was we all watched this happen live I think but
47:09
part of the glove basically is is too small to fit him but part of the Assumption is that he had arthritis
47:15
which makes your joints flare yeah and that part of the medication for it is an anti-inflammatory which he had stopped
47:21
taking so his joints would flare up expand its size and make it difficult to put the gloves on easily like
47:27
realistically it could have been the fact that the gloves were had been
47:32
completely soaked in blood the fact that they've been frozen yeah like and also
47:39
because of preservative issue preservation issues they had Frozen and defrost the gloves multiple multiple
47:44
times and also the thing I didn't detail I forgot about was that he was also wearing latex clubs underneath the
47:50
gloves when he was when he tried them on at trial he was I didn't know that yeah yeah
47:56
I don't know why they yeah I don't know why they did it that way well Jesus yeah one thing I didn't
48:03
know until after researching this was they also brought in a brand new pair of
48:11
these gloves the same size gloves to have him try them on and they fit perfectly but nobody remembers that
48:17
right um what yeah that's ridiculous I didn't know that and I didn't know the like what
48:23
that is well that is suspicious
48:29
yeah so one of the one of my favorite Parts about this which again I didn't write this down but it was I I admire
48:36
his attorneys so much because they're like schoolyard kids apparently
48:43
they've been planning this they they didn't want to be the ones that call OJ op to try on the gloves
48:50
they wanted the prosecution to do it to make them look foolish because they had assumed that because of the blood
48:55
because of the freezing and defrosting because they literally he didn't take his arthritis medicine they knew it
49:01
wasn't gonna fit right and so apparently right while they're at in the middle of like the trial they're basically goading
49:08
the prosecutors saying yeah if you're so confident it's almost really cool down go ahead do it you tactics
49:17
um exactly like give them oh my God and yeah this is another part of it that
49:22
I actually really really loved was again they were so good at the psychology of litigation which is like its own
49:28
separate like area of study they mind [ __ ] Marcia Clark and Chris Darden the
49:33
co-chair the co-prosecution during closing arguments which Chris started as the one who
49:39
did on the prosecution side this is a time for each side to tell their story
49:46
because point you've heard so much about like DNA
49:52
enzyme this and expert that like you've glossed over so much this is a time when
49:57
you can kind of wrap it up into this really nice clean package and like it's theater like that's really what it's
50:03
meant to be do you read the closing argument or the prosecution objected
50:09
71 times oh my God 69 of these were overruled they were
50:16
just trying to mess up the flow because this guy's trying oh 100 yeah he was
50:21
trying he like he probably sat there in front of his like mirror in practice all his gestations and movements of the
50:26
hands and all that and they were just like objections and you just stop okay now we gotta keep jerks yeah so at one
50:34
point Judge Ito threatened to hold the defense in contempt if they kept doing
50:40
it which is like a huge that's kind of like the last straw right like that's
50:45
yeah Johnny Cochran who was the lead counsel for OJ he made this whole thing
50:53
about race and racism of the LAPD he compared Mark Fuhrman to Adolf Hitler
51:01
and I think the best part of all of this is that he offered literally zero proof
51:08
of a cover-up he just said things but he said that with the kind of conviction that a good really good Storyteller can
51:15
say and that was it it was literally like there was again there during the
51:21
trial they're just trying to counter the arguments of the prosecution they're not
51:27
painting a picture of all the other things what their theory is of what happened they are just right there's no
51:33
yeah there's no like there's never been like an investigation to see who else could have done it
51:40
that doesn't exist yeah yeah all this was painted is racism so Mark
51:46
Fuhrman basically tanked the state's case against OJ
51:51
because he perjured himself saying I'm not racist then he's caught on this tape so that's that's it really
51:59
um and frankly because two years prior all these people again think about the the
52:04
um the makeup of the jury all these people saw the LA riots happening and they framed all in the Rodney King
52:10
meeting and everything else that went on with LAPD he's like they were right for this story to resonate with them to
52:16
again remind everyone how big of a deal this was Bill Clinton who was president at the time of this trial he was being
52:22
updated regularly about the jury deliberations because he was ready to
52:27
deploy the National Guard if another ride were to break out that makes sense
52:33
the jury deliberated for four hours and obviously like I set up at the top they returned a verdict of acquittal one of
52:40
the jurors did the Black Panther fist race thing at OJ when the verdict was
52:45
read further illustrating just how much race played a factor in all of this
52:51
it seriously because there's again one of the 50 000 documentaries that were
52:56
made about this um case that guy the guy who did the Black Panther the juror who did that uh he was in a documentary
53:03
about the case in 2016. he came out in that documentary saying on retrospect he
53:09
should have voted for Guilt so that's what he yeah it's like man thank you sir
53:14
what are you like you're 22 years too late but yeah oh my God good point
53:19
hilarious driving the point even further 75 of White America thought that he was
53:24
guilty 70 percent of African-Americans saw that he was in a Sim it's worth noting that the numbers
53:32
narrowed since then so in 2016 again another poll was taken where 57 of
53:38
African-Americans think that he is actually guilty so that that swayed I
53:43
think it was just there was so much tension yeah definitely that is mostly
53:48
it what followed was a string of other legal and financial battles OJ was sued
53:54
by Fred Goldman who was Ron's incredibly Mustachio father and he lost a 33
54:01
million dollar judgment because again it was a wrongful death like it was a different burden of proof
54:07
and he lost that he went on to try and publish a book called if I did it which
54:12
the Goldman family sued him over they later published the book but reduced the If part to such tiny font that the
54:20
actual print of the cover red I did it in 2008 yeah in 2008 he was sentenced to
54:27
33 years in prison for breaking into the hotel room of a sports memorabilia collector and stealing a bunch of stuff
54:34
which admittedly it was like his stuff I know I I it was O.J Simpson memorabilia that he owned it but he was found guilty
54:41
of armed robbery and kidnapping he ultimately served nine years um in prison and then was Parole in
54:47
2017. I put some fun facts here that are kind of just add some color to this like
54:55
I said we talked about a little bit before man this guy was such a different
55:00
human before this happened in such a different person after it happened he went on to host and create a prank show
55:07
called used which is the worst concept I've ever
55:12
heard of it thankfully died a quiet death after just one episode but basically it was
55:20
like a pranked style reality show where things happen to people and then
55:26
OJ jumps out and says you got juice and it's like I hate princess are so stupid and also
55:32
that is so dumb like do you think people are happy because you'd be a little scared you'd be like are you gonna murder me you'd be
55:39
terrified like O.J Simpson jumps out of nowhere and it's like he's laughing and he's still
55:45
like a huge dude and it's like what what what's going on like like do we no you'd be real confused so
55:54
thankfully that died quietly the LAPD later on refused
56:01
to reopen the case the police chief came out of the time and said quote the acquittal doesn't mean there's
56:07
another murderer again everybody knew he did it so yeah
56:13
they didn't like no one ever tried to find anybody else yeah exactly I there's another fun fact
56:18
that I wrote down here around um around one of my absolute all-time favorite comedians ever I learned about
56:25
this after his death recently I think it was maybe a year or two ago that it happened but Norm McDonald's are you familiar with Norm McDonald's Taylor I
56:32
knew I knew you were going to say Norm Macdonald keep going did you okay so I don't know the joke but I knew that he'd be the person that you were talking
56:37
about yeah totally so if you if you're unfamiliar with him he is this hilarious
56:43
deadpan comic Who Rose to fame on SNL in the 1990s I would describe his comedy as
56:49
kind of the embodiment of just really not giving a [ __ ] about consequences Norm anchored the joke news show on SNL
56:56
called weekend updates he was apparently told by Executives at NBC who's the
57:01
company that produces SNL to stop making jokes about OJ this exec named Don olmeyer was
57:09
apparently super close friends with OJ and all these jokes were written by Norm himself and one writer on SNL called Jim
57:17
Downey Jim was actually fired outright and Norm was fired from doing the
57:23
weekend anchor role he was still on SNL but he very shortly had to leave that as
57:28
well I watched all these segments he did it's totally worth a YouTube is it not
57:34
because I think making fun of OJ is particularly funny or that you know or any of that it's more like you watch him
57:40
knowingly seek his career with his grin on his face and just being like guys this is looter you know what it reminded
57:47
me of was even at NBC the executives there are trying to protect this guy and
57:53
there was something indignant about Norm MacDonald's attitude that was like I don't even think he was doing it for the
57:58
comedy I think he was doing it for like this is insane why are we trying to treat this guy with any sort of reverence you know like like I remember
58:09
I remember right after I don't know if it was him or if it was someone else but on Weekend Update they did the thing
58:15
with like the picture of OJ and they said well it's still murder is legal in California yeah okay I remember yeah I
58:23
wrote um I wrote one of these down because so he he would deliberately interject it in just total non-sequitur
58:29
ways again just pointing out the lunacy of why are we trying to protect this guy he did a segment on Charles and Diana's
58:36
divorce which was going out of this at this time and he um he threw this graphic up that was like and Charles
58:42
wrote a book about it his picture of Charles in the book cover read of course OJ did it come on but it just has
58:49
nothing he said about Diana and Charles but he made a point to do this um and yeah I just thought that was
58:56
absolutely fantastic kind of like speaking truth to power in a way that nobody did O.J Simpson so yeah yeah it
59:04
goes to Norm Macdonald um but that's my story wow wow my the only concern theory that I've heard that
59:10
I kind of like is I did hear it from crime junkie I think another podcast they did um like a special where there's
59:17
a theory that like OJ's gone from his first marriage was is or was like a
59:24
little unstable and he was not invited to that dinner after the recital and he
59:29
was really mad and that's why and then he went and killed her but obviously that's not true but that's like the only
59:34
thing I've heard of them it's like has a little bit of like maybe that could have happened but really like
59:40
man he definitely did it have you ever met anybody who's said he didn't do it
59:46
I remember when I was looking at I was in like middle school and I was like
59:51
people talked about it all the time and I was like maybe he didn't do it also but I mean I was 12 what am I supposed to know you know but I don't think I
59:58
don't know who I was hearing that from or whatever but no I don't know anybody now who would say that he didn't do it
1:00:04
yeah I can't imagine someone said they've been like yeah he lives in Florida and he's out of jail
1:00:10
and just like goes to Costco it's weird so weird so weird like he's just a national like it's like
1:00:17
you're that is the only thing you're known for I mean it's crazy to think that like all the accomplishments all
1:00:22
that bullet point I listed off of all the things that he did all the gun he's the guy who killed his
1:00:28
wife yeah like that's basically it so and you can't even like celebrate him for his Sports achievements because you just
1:00:34
can't so there it doesn't matter you know his Jersey's still retired which I was kind of surprised by but I don't
1:00:40
know so that's my story and um yeah yeah
1:00:46
wall times so far Taylor today
1:00:51
I know that in our thing in our um in our theme song it's it's JFK and um we're
1:00:59
thinking Jackie and and him but actually I'm gonna go
1:01:04
all the Kennedys and talk about the Kennedy curse so there's so many bad
1:01:13
things that happen to the Kennedys so I'm going to kind of go through them it's going to be a little out of order
1:01:18
but it's also going to be kind of like reading the Bible because I'm going to be like Jack son of blah blah because I'm gonna go person by person and just
1:01:25
tell you the bad things that happened to them there were nine Kennedy children
1:01:30
a lot of bad things there were nine Kennedy children they all have tragic stories um Kennedy women aren't as cursed as the
1:01:37
men take that for what you will um and outside of these tragedies there are plenty of non-profits and good
1:01:43
political decisions and things that they did um but a lot of bad things like not even bad things that they did bad things that
1:01:49
happened to them so a lot of things that you could definitely you know lean towards there being some sort of curse
1:01:54
they have the Kennedys are as you know an American political family they there
1:01:59
have been very few years in the past 100 years that a Kennedy has not held public office there's almost always someone there
1:02:05
they're almost always federally as well so for my research I did a lot of just like compiling from Wikipedia but also I
1:02:13
read a James Patterson book on the Kennedys so it was like a a book that he wrote that's non-fiction but about their
1:02:20
stories so some of the more dramatic things I'm going to start with the parents of the Kennedy children and kind
1:02:27
of go from there the dad of JFK the patriarch is Joseph Patrick Kennedy as
1:02:34
you can tell he's very Irish and very Catholic that's a very Irish name Joseph Patrick Kennedy was born in 1888 is her
1:02:41
own political family in Boston he made his money in the stock market he would do these things called stock pools with
1:02:46
other with other investors that was a little shady and he shorted a lot of
1:02:51
stock before the crash in 1929. so by 1935 in the height of the depression
1:02:59
in today's dollars the Kennedys were worth 3.5 billion dollars whoa so
1:03:06
they were fine they have a lot of [ __ ] money Uber Rich exactly totally and JFK you know
1:03:13
one of the problems that he had running for president is that he had no idea of
1:03:18
what people had been through during the Depression he just wasn't involved you know
1:03:24
um so Joe uh definitely had connections to the mafia at one point he leaves his
1:03:29
family he goes to Hollywood to try to open a studio he invested in a lot of movies like kind of like B movies like
1:03:34
cowboy movies he had a long affair with the actress Gloria Swanson and also I'll
1:03:41
mention this kind of periodically but every single Kennedy man had a ton of Affairs and it's just not interesting
1:03:47
because everyone was doing it but yeah dad and did it a ton
1:03:54
he after prohibition he worked with James Roosevelt to sell liquor so he
1:04:00
knew like that Franklin Eleanor Roosevelt's kids he definitely had connections to the mafias is doing some
1:04:05
shady things and all this time you know he's still very very Catholic he holds
1:04:11
several political positions he was president of the SEC and then the big one he does is from 1938 to 1940 Joseph
1:04:19
Kennedy is the ambassador to England which is an interesting time to be the ambassador to England because right as
1:04:25
we're getting into World War II and he was definitely the wrong guy to do that he was a little bit of a like I
1:04:33
don't know maybe a wet noodle about it or maybe he just was like too rich to care about it but he was like why do we
1:04:38
have to fight why don't we just see what this Hitler guy has to say yeah yeah I I do remember some stuff
1:04:44
around um his he had like a weird affinity for eugenics what I recall yeah
1:04:51
and so that makes sense yeah this kind of Falls in line yeah that totally makes sense because
1:04:57
all the Kennedys like look the same and have like the same thing I mean I feel like it kind of fits into that but he was like he tried to meet with Hitler
1:05:02
twice and you never actually got the meeting but one British MP said of him
1:05:09
he said quote we have a rich man untrained in diplomacy unlearned and history and politics who was a great
1:05:15
publicity seeker and who apparently is ambitious to be the first Catholic President of the United States so like
1:05:21
no one took him seriously um out there and he was also anti-semitic unsurprisingly and the
1:05:28
things he said are bad but generally it was like Hitler has some good ideas what's the problem what's what's weird
1:05:35
about all that is um at that time in history I wish people were very much looked down upon in the
1:05:41
U.S like they were like yeah they were minority right and he's definitely from a minority yeah and it's just
1:05:47
interesting like he doesn't see the irony and like his own belief system and
1:05:53
how people treat him directly totally totally
1:05:58
yeah so I mean that's just you know part of his personality he was also like a very strict father he raised his
1:06:05
children to always win um you know they you know had to be the best and he basically raised them all to
1:06:11
be president that was his goal Joe does he dies of complications of a stroke in 1969 so the timeline's gonna be a little
1:06:19
weird but he he dies in 1969. he married Rose Kennedy she was born Rose
1:06:24
Fitzgerald um in 1890 she actually died in 1995 when she was
1:06:30
104 which is some of these women that's crazy I can't believe it was that recent time
1:06:36
I know so she was also very very Catholic she met Joe at parties in like a rich Society she devoted her life to her her
1:06:44
children that was really that was Rose's thing she was you know a grandmother a great grandmother a mother that was her
1:06:50
number one thing that she did and um Jacqueline Kennedy Jackie Kennedy described her mother-in-law it while in
1:06:58
a letter to a priest she said I don't think Jack's mother is too bright and she would rather say a rosary than read
1:07:04
a book so a little bit of like internal criticism about how much she relied on I'm being Catholic for things but that
1:07:11
was Rose she was the mom so obviously yeah how do you think me and you would
1:07:17
do it one of those parties that I totally agree I think we talked about this before like I do not fit in you
1:07:24
would see me like a sore freaking thumb people would ask me for a drink because they would think I worked there they
1:07:29
just it just I don't think I could fit in it's a laugh I don't think I could nail them laugh I think because I feel
1:07:34
the laugh is so like yeah it's just I don't know I'm too
1:07:41
Gruff I think I'm a little bit too rough for that yeah I think I'm just I got the shadow of I don't know
1:07:47
not being rich my whole life yeah
1:07:52
um yeah no it's definitely a society that like I don't know I don't fit in and don't know anything about but they
1:07:58
you know yeah exactly so now I want to talk about all nine of your children I'm going to
1:08:05
do it in order and it'll be maybe confusing but some stories that maybe you haven't heard
1:08:10
um will get to the first Warren sun is Joseph Kennedy Jr he was born in 1915.
1:08:17
he was the one who was going to be president he was super handsome like they're all handsome whatever he was
1:08:23
like super handsome he was older brother he was really being groomed to to be
1:08:28
president of the US by his family he was also anti-semitic and had some of his
1:08:33
dad's ideas there's like a story that was in the James Patterson book where um Joe Jr was working with a professor
1:08:41
at school who was Jewish and he was like yeah it's too bad that that guy has to go but in general it's fine you know
1:08:47
like not great so but he was um even even though he was very active in World War
1:08:53
II um he married an actress Sheila Rauch in 1940 that had no children because in
1:09:01
1990 in 1994 1944 while serving as a naval pilot during World War II Joe went
1:09:08
on a mission that he didn't have to go on and it was a little bit like the plane may not have been ready but he was
1:09:13
like I'm brave and I'm gonna go on this he had already done some pretty dangerous missions in in World War II
1:09:19
and his plane exploded over England so he died in 1944. obviously super sad
1:09:29
to have like the older brother first tragedy of many that Joe Jr died that way
1:09:34
and the second son is John F Kennedy he was born in 1917.
1:09:40
he was a sixth child he had back injuries after being injured in World War II so a big part of his story is how
1:09:48
many drugs he was on when he was president have you heard those stories I have yeah it was apparently that injury
1:09:55
was like almost debilitating yeah the kid to wear a back brace and like so you
1:10:01
know during the Cuban Missile Crisis the person in charge is like pretty [ __ ] up so super interesting if
1:10:07
people had known that maybe like they wouldn't have he wouldn't have gotten as far as he did but he was you know in a lot of pain for a lot of his life but
1:10:14
Commander he would have been on like opiates right
1:10:19
oh 100 yeah yeah he had like literally the doctor they called Dr Feelgood was his doctor
1:10:25
so yeah it was absolutely a whole bunch of [ __ ] yeah it was like you know a pill to go
1:10:31
to sleep a pill to wake up a pill to do this lots of shots those kind of things he sounds like a burning man attendee
1:10:38
yeah um he was injured in World War II like we
1:10:43
said he was a commander of a patrol torpedo craft and um he I think he saved a couple of
1:10:49
people when it got um like torpedoed he is the only president to have
1:10:55
the Marine Corp medal and the Purple Heart either of those like he's really like
1:11:00
probably one of the most decorated presidents besides like Eisenhower it's actually pretty cool um he married yeah
1:11:06
it's pretty cool because he seems like he did a good job over there especially like after his brother died you know he still went over there
1:11:11
um which I think was pretty pretty brave I know that he like couldn't get in immediately because of his injuries and
1:11:16
his like history of like being kind of sickly but he ended up getting in
1:11:21
however that happened and um was actually pretty pretty heroic in there
1:11:27
um so he married Jacqueline Lee beauvier in 1953 she was also a socialite but she
1:11:33
was like doing okay she had a job as a reporter and she when he proposed to her and she left without answering she went
1:11:42
to England for Queen Elizabeth's coronation so she had a pretty cool job and she was sort of reluctant to marry
1:11:47
him he already had had a lot of girlfriends and he didn't plan to stop having girlfriends you know that was
1:11:54
kind of part of it as well but they got married anyway and JFK and Jackie have
1:11:59
this kind of like perfect looking marriage they have four kids they have
1:12:04
Arabella is born still born in 1956 so that's one tragedy of them for their
1:12:11
kids Caroline is still alive she's still involved in politics she has three kids she's still you know with us
1:12:19
um JFK Jr can you picture JFK Jr yeah I remember this guy so he was born
1:12:24
in 1960. he was two when his dad died and he was always in the public eye there's like a picture of him in his
1:12:31
like little like nice coat as dad's funeral so super sad obviously
1:12:37
um in the 90s he was like a political Playboy he was a lawyer but he like barely made
1:12:43
it um he like barely scooted by law school all these guys went to like Harvard and Stanford and all that in Yale and you know
1:12:49
um so but he started a political magazine called George you heard of that okay yeah yeah so that um
1:12:56
that's like one of my favorite facts about him actually is so full disclosure the first time I threw the bar exam I
1:13:02
failed and passed the second time but when you fail it it feels awful like you
1:13:08
feel like like everybody's moving on to Greater bigger things and you got to go back to the books and and try again and
1:13:15
knowing that he failed he failed the bar shitload like he felt like somewhere between three and five times like he had
1:13:21
a really hard time getting past it it's one of those things that money is Never Gonna Get You There completely you got
1:13:28
to kind of do it on your own and so I was uh we leaned on that a little bit I was like well if someone like that can
1:13:33
keep failing then then it's all good and it's all good totally that's good
1:13:39
um yeah so he you know became a lawyer but he was really mostly like a political Playboy like I said he started
1:13:45
a political magazine called George which sexy politics like the first the first
1:13:50
issue had what's her face like the really famous model from the 90s like
1:13:56
dressed like George Washington no not Cindy Crawford Kate Moss was in it too like they're all in it he that was like
1:14:02
the circles he was in he's on Oprah there's an episode of Seinfeld where like Elaine season at the gym and she's
1:14:07
like really excited uh he's like the sexiest man alive he's also like I don't know if this is what you picture when
1:14:12
you picture him but he has like a very hairy chest and I feel like I don't see that in the cover of magazines anymore
1:14:18
okay I haven't in a long time didn't picture that did you picture that
1:14:24
but I pictured him with like 90s sexy like Tom Selleck you know like hairy chest and a lot of hair
1:14:29
so he was like the most eligible bachelor or sexiest man alive um all those things and and I think he
1:14:36
probably struggled with it a little bit you know people he's one thing that it said in the James Patterson book that like someone was like oh everybody sees
1:14:43
you and they know who you are and he was like everybody looks at me and they know who my dad is but I don't know who my
1:14:48
dad is like he didn't get to meet him he didn't get to really see him so that's sad I can imagine that
1:14:55
on the outside looking in you're like what a charm life right like you're uber Rich you're Kennedy your
1:15:01
good looking living I think he was in New York or something wasn't he yeah and I think on the outside it could
1:15:08
seem like it's all um rainbows and sunshine but there's got to be a lot of like how do you how do
1:15:14
you how do you um create your own life when you're like you're a pretty
1:15:21
big Shadow especially for him yeah
1:15:27
the king queen of Camelot at one point like they were yeah it was like Camelot it was like a perfect marriage of power
1:15:34
and all these things and yeah yeah that's gonna be tough to grow up in that yeah totally
1:15:40
so JFK Jr marries another rich woman named Carolyn Bessette she was also like
1:15:46
not super soaked at marrying him but then she did and they were like a dream couple of the 90s and
1:15:54
it sounds like they had like a lot of problems and they were maybe going to get a divorce and another thing about
1:16:00
JFK Jr is he always wanted to fly like he was obsessed with like planes and when his dad even like up until he was
1:16:05
two when his dad would like go somewhere on a trip come back with a toy plane and like he just loved it and Jackie told
1:16:12
him not to learn how to fly but he did anyway and so in 1999 King Carolina probably
1:16:18
separated but they're going to a wedding anyway so he's gonna he says I want to take you and your sister to this wedding
1:16:23
um we're gonna fly out of New York and go look up the coast and he should not have done this he was not
1:16:31
certified he was not complete with all of his training for being a pilot his ankle was broken and you need two feet
1:16:38
to be able to do what he needed to do in that plane so you defeat to do it too but his ankle is broken and
1:16:45
it's the same thing it's like this attitude that I can't remember what it's called but that like Pilots saved like a
1:16:50
like a gotta get their attitude which is kind of what happened to Kobe Bryant as well where it's like the pilot is like
1:16:55
oh no I can do this I have to get there like I'm Invincible you know and
1:17:01
um he's you know what I mean so he got up in this like little plane and he probably lost uh sight of the Horizon
1:17:08
because it was really dark so we couldn't see the Horizon and he had also like he almost hit like an American or
1:17:15
some Airline like passenger plane first and then he was kind of like flying erratically and then he disappeared off
1:17:21
a radar and they found the plane like two days later so he also like I don't know there's a Malcolm Gladwell book
1:17:28
where I can't remember which one it is but where he talks about this you know losing side of the Horizon thing and he's in a plane with a pilot and the
1:17:35
Pilot's trying to explain to him what might have happened and he says like okay I'm going to the pilot says I'm
1:17:41
going to point the plane down and put us in a spiral and you're not gonna feel it and
1:17:48
because of like the force nothing glad was like okay and then like a minute later he's like okay you can start and
1:17:54
the pilot was like we're already doing it like you couldn't tell you know so that might have been would have happened like he was like everything's fine but
1:18:00
just imagine so JFK Jr dies in a terrible way in 1999 um the fourth child of of Jackie and
1:18:07
Jack is a son named Patrick who lived for two days he was born in 1963. so
1:18:13
pretty tragic um you know their their kids situation in the other obviously thing that you
1:18:20
know about is in 1963 we all know JFK is the president there in Dallas just like you
1:18:25
um the Dallas Morning News hates him I wrote an article about how much I don't like him in the car in Dallas the
1:18:31
governor's wife says see Dallas loves you Texas loves you you know to him and right after she says that he's shot from
1:18:38
the sixth floor of a building by a crazy man named Lee Harvey Oswald um both this and another assassination
1:18:44
we'll talk about like I wish it was a conspiracy but it's just a crazy guy you know like a really radicalized person
1:18:51
the Harvey Oswald like wanted to defect to Russia they wouldn't let him in he wanted to be a socialist all these
1:18:57
things so just kind of a crazy person um there is a theory Taylor
1:19:03
yeah sorry the overlap because there's some lag in the Wi-Fi so I mean you keep interrupting it's just there's a lag
1:19:09
there no words did you ever listen to the last podcast on the left about JFK yeah
1:19:15
yeah do you remember what the theory was you talk about the Secret Service yeah
1:19:21
yeah so the idea is that or the the theory is that when an action ends up
1:19:27
happening was Oswald did set off the events but the actual bullet that tore
1:19:34
JFK's head off the theory is came from the secret service agent behind the
1:19:39
president's limousine so Oswald fired the first shot hit the ground part of the second shot hit the president in the
1:19:47
neck and Connolly in the shoulder in them at that point the Secret Service
1:19:52
unsafe need the gun to try and do something the car lurched and the guy fell backwards and there he is that he
1:19:58
shot him in the back of the head that way so anyways random aside I love that I think that's fun that they were like
1:20:04
super hungover and just were like not doing their job well also like it's weird because the way that Kennedy moves
1:20:10
when he gets shot like it's confusing to people but it's also because he's wearing a back brace so yeah you could
1:20:17
that could be your job you could just learn about it that could be all you do um but um man [ __ ] poor Jackie she is
1:20:26
holding his brains in her hand and like it brings to the doctor it was like here I have these brains you know like absolutely horrifying that evening she's
1:20:34
on Air Force One with his body she's still covered in blood she's wearing her like her famous pink Chanel suit covered in
1:20:41
blood while while LBJ gets sworn in on Air Force One so a really [ __ ] horrifying horrifying situation
1:20:49
um Jackie remarries pretty quickly to a Greek man named Aristotle Onassis um Aristotle's daughter is like do not
1:20:56
marry this [ __ ] woman she is cursed while they're married Aristotle's son dies in a plane crash
1:21:02
and they separate but they never divorce because he passes away so by 45 she's
1:21:07
been a widow twice and then does not get married again um Jackie dies of cancer in 1994. so she
1:21:14
lives like 30 or so years more than Jack did well tragedy you could that could be your job your whole life could be about
1:21:20
those two but let's move on so the third child maybe the most
1:21:26
worst story is as of Rosemary Rosemary was born on September 3rd 1918 you know
1:21:33
I wrote poor [ __ ] Rosemary Kennedy like this is the worst
1:21:38
um her birth is an actual Horror Story um her mother was giving birth The
1:21:45
Midwives wanted to wait for the doctor but the doctor couldn't get there because of like I don't know a storm something happened so they had to wait
1:21:51
two hours and the Midwife instead of just delivering the baby kept her in the
1:21:57
birth canal so made of the labor two hours longer than it needed to be and
1:22:02
she was like literally holding the baby's head so the baby would not come out and like I cannot think of a single
1:22:08
[ __ ] reason to do that take the baby out um but because of that she was definitely deprived of oxygen and so I
1:22:15
think that was like something that like made her a little bit disabled um from that experience yeah she wasn't
1:22:21
like a terrible person she just had trouble in academics she couldn't really read she has special tutors you know she
1:22:26
was um she was also super depressed because people treated her differently all these things about her
1:22:32
um when she is like in her 20s her parents sent her to a Convent but she keeps leaving the convent at night
1:22:38
because she wants to like have a life you know like she's a grown woman who you know is just has some like you know
1:22:45
problems with reading and comprehension it's not like nothing's terribly wrong with her and because of that her parents
1:22:52
are worried that she could like get an STD or get pregnant or something and they're just like
1:22:58
pretty embarrassed of her really her doing things stupid and I'm sure [ __ ] Joe yeah she sounds just breakfast
1:23:05
yeah it's like nothing terrible exactly
1:23:10
um and when she was 23 her father decided to have her lobotomized which was experimental at best it was never
1:23:17
like a great procedure and as far as you want to tell everybody what a lobotomy is I feel like you know
1:23:23
oh yeah um so this is when where they take a ice
1:23:28
pick through your eye socket push your eye sock your eyeball out of the way
1:23:34
stick the um ice pick up into the frontal cortex of your brain and just kind of wiggle it around a bunch
1:23:41
and turn you and hope for the best home for the best basically turning you into
1:23:46
like a very close approximation of a zombie yeah yeah and that's what
1:23:52
happened to to Rosemary after her lobotomy she ends up with a mental capacity of a two-year-old and her
1:23:59
family introduced institutionalized her and many of them never saw her again
1:24:04
um her when Joe senior her dad died they did start bringing her around again oh great and you know bring her to
1:24:10
things and and that she was always in like a nice facility but still and she died of natural causes at 85. so she
1:24:18
lived like most of her life after this horrifying procedure happened to her it wasn't that long ago yeah that she died
1:24:24
right she died in 2005. yeah so there was a person living in 2005 who
1:24:30
had their brain Scramble with an iceberg like this sounds like yeah that's that's
1:24:37
absolutely horrifying so poor Rosemary um so she was the third the fourth uh
1:24:45
Kennedy child is Kathleen kick Kennedy so it's called another kick she married
1:24:51
she was really close to Joe junior or her older brother she married a Lutheran Englishman the Marquess of Hartington
1:24:59
um and it was a big deal obviously because he was Lutheran and they're very Catholic and they married and he died
1:25:05
pretty soon after they were married he was shot by a German sniper during World War II which
1:25:12
is super sad they had no children because he died so quickly after their marriage and then she hit herself died
1:25:18
in the plane crash on May 13th 1948. so 100.
1:25:27
[Laughter] so kick had a short and sad life
1:25:34
um number five is Eunice Kennedy so Eunice was born in 1921. she married Robert Sergeant Shriver in 1953 he was
1:25:42
the first director of the Peace Corps so he did a lot of good things they had five kids um Robert Maria Timothy Mark and Anthony
1:25:49
you'll remember Maria she married Arnold Schwarzenegger yep um she was the first lady of California they got divorced
1:25:55
after it was covered that he had a child with their maid which I'm sure was not his only Affair um their son Patrick is an actor their
1:26:02
daughter Catherine is married to the worst Chris she's married to Chris Pratt Chris
1:26:09
I'm not the only one who says this but of all the Hollywood Chris's Chris Pratt is the worst Chris and I think a lot of it is because he's like super religious
1:26:16
and like very like Jesus helped me do this which is really annoying and a lot of people just like think he's very like
1:26:21
haughty like when you see him and Catherine together she has these like this like weird smile you know like they
1:26:26
just like seem kind of weird I found a self-help book she wrote in like the 90s about like hey my life is so hard blah
1:26:33
blah blah and like I don't know I know we said JFK Junior's life must have been hard but also [ __ ] you but like I don't know like they
1:26:40
don't seem great how does she get a pass on having a hard life I don't know I don't know and then like well one thing
1:26:46
about Chris Pratt I also think like maybe he's a great actor because like Owen Grady in Jurassic Park is super sexy but if
1:26:54
you like look at Chris Pratt in real life you're like ew I think that's the worst I can't explain
1:27:01
that like I I really like a bad character you get everyone [Laughter]
1:27:06
but so that's one of one of Eunice's granddaughters um Eunice was like a mother to a lot of
1:27:12
the Kennedy children um she was you know stayed you know with the family a lot and one thing that she did that is fantastic that you know one
1:27:19
of the many like things that they do that's actually like really good and a lot of philanthropy she started the Special Olympics in honor of rose of her
1:27:27
sister and um when I yeah I went to the Special Olympics opening a ceremony a few years
1:27:32
ago in La I don't know how we got tickets to it but it was beautiful I cried the whole freaking time and Maria
1:27:38
Shriver spoke and it's really great that they did that so that's super cool it was awesome yeah
1:27:44
so the sixth child is Patricia she was born in 1924. oh also Eunice died in
1:27:50
2009 so she also lived to be very old um Patricia is the number six she was
1:27:56
born in 1924 she died in 2006. she married actor Peter Lawford I don't know if you know who that is
1:28:03
um but I know him from Easter Parade um Easter Parade is one of my favorite movies and so like I was just like
1:28:09
really excited that anyone got to marry Peter Lawford because I just thought I've always thought he was so handsome um but he sounds like kind of a douche
1:28:14
you know I don't even recognize his teacher yeah he was like a not cool they
1:28:21
called him the least um talented member of the Rat Pack like he wasn't really in the Rat Pack but he
1:28:26
was like on the outside of it because uh Joe was trying to get the Rat Pack and like people in the mafia to get people
1:28:33
to vote for JFK so they had like Peter Lawford like go in and try to be cool and Frank Sinatra was like yeah I
1:28:39
totally want to hang out with JFK but he ended up having a pure Lawford and he was like really disappointed which is funny it would be status I'm the saddest
1:28:48
Rat Pack member I know it's so funny have
1:28:54
you I don't have four kids and they do get divorced eventually but they have four kids and like the divorce stuff I
1:29:00
couldn't figure it all out some of them get divorced some of them don't it's also weird because they're Catholic and like you can't get divorced all these
1:29:06
things Patricia and Peter Lawford do get divorced um the only one of their four kids with the Wikipedia page is Christopher he was
1:29:12
an actor and he was super involved in drugs as a teen he got arrested for impersonating a doctor to get drugs and
1:29:19
his cousin who we'll talk about later ODS he sobered up and he was sober for 33 years he did a lot of activism for
1:29:26
drug awareness but he died of a heart attack when he was 63. so it sounds like he
1:29:32
turned his life around after all that bad stuff happened so that's Patricia and Peter's number seven is Robert S Kennedy he was
1:29:40
born on November 20th 1925. I wrote Bobby Bobby Kennedy
1:29:46
um he married yeah he married Ethel skagel and they had 11 children which is
1:29:52
too many children just wait too many children I know one of those kids that I think you're going to talk about was the
1:29:57
name skate Okay Google sounds really familiar there's a there's a schedule story it's
1:30:03
it's her nephew but we'll get there so they had Kathleen Kathleen was lieutenant governor of Maryland from
1:30:08
1985 2003 she's still involved in politics her daughter Maeve died in 2002
1:30:14
and like the weirdest way so her daughter was 40 years old and her and her son went on a canoe on a lake and
1:30:21
they both just disappeared they found their bodies later like something happened and they both died which is terrible Wild
1:30:27
um they have Joseph who's blonde I don't know if like not many of them are blonde he's an energy businessman he got
1:30:34
married in 1979 and he tried to get divorced in 1993 but he was like I'm
1:30:39
Catholic I can't get divorced he tried to get an annulled by saying that when he was married he was in a bad mental
1:30:45
state but like it's been 15 years can't get in an old you know and his wife wrote a book called this is so sad
1:30:52
called shattered Faith a woman's struggled to stop the Catholic Church from annulling her marriage
1:30:59
everybody got that you're how how important do you think
1:31:05
you are like more [ __ ] real but but you know that's like again how could how
1:31:11
could Catholic everybody is Joseph had two sons they're twins one of them is a
1:31:17
ginger and he's currently the ambassador of North Ireland this looks like a Kennedy with red hair which is kind of pleasure so number three is RFK Jr and
1:31:25
so there's this woman who writes for Vanity Fair who writes a newsletter I actually haven't gotten in a while so I
1:31:30
wonder if he still works there but her name is Beth Levin and she's fantastic like she just has I just like love
1:31:35
reading her stuff and she called Robert F Kennedy Jr an example of an apple
1:31:41
falling as far from the tree as possible oh that's kind of mean what why why let
1:31:48
me tell you so he did a lot of activism a lot of environmental stuff so he worked a lot on that he was been married a couple times ex-wife actually killed
1:31:55
herself which was pretty tragic and I think that that happened after some of his Affairs were like out in public
1:32:00
which is a bummer but then he did the bad thing he is anti-vaccination like
1:32:08
real hard like all of them okay he's one of those people that is like do your own
1:32:14
research and do it on your own schedule and it's like oh my God I'm not a [ __ ] doctor I'm listening to my doctors what are you talking about so he
1:32:20
has done all this stuff about vaccines connected to autism which is not true he doesn't like the flu vaccine and then of
1:32:27
course he hates the coven vaccine he literally wrote a book called the real
1:32:32
Anthony fauci Bill Gates big Pharma and the global war on democracy and public health he's an idiot yeah he's in that
1:32:39
job yeah wrote he sucks [ __ ] that guy so [ __ ] you RFK Jr hope you're listening
1:32:45
then fourth kid of their 11 is David David has a fun story because he almost
1:32:51
drowned while RFK was running for president and he saved him and it was very heroic David was the only member of
1:32:57
the family to stay up late on the news as his dad RFK accepted the nomination
1:33:03
for the Democratic president and so he's the one who saw the news about his dad being shot before everybody else did
1:33:09
which is terrible he was 12. and he turned to drugs like after that he got
1:33:15
into a car accident there's so much drunk driving just assumed that like everybody's been drunk driving this
1:33:20
whole time David got in a car accident his girlfriend was paralyzed he was injured and in 1984 he died of a drug
1:33:26
overdose so he was very troubled I think probably obviously from his dad being assassinated and him being like the
1:33:32
first one to see it and all of that yeah the next kid is Mary Courtney she married an Irishman they had one
1:33:38
daughter daughter named sorsha and she died of a drug overdose and 2019 so
1:33:44
another drug overdose death then there's Michael and Michael is a nerd who looks like a
1:33:52
cartoon of his dad he looks like Bobby Kennedy if you like took your hands and Bobby Kennedy's head and stretched it
1:33:57
out an inch like he has really long teeth it's like a lot um Frank Gifford's daughter look him up
1:34:03
that's Michael Kennedy dude he's mostly don't read my body weight mostly teeth
1:34:09
yeah and he's in the news because he married Frank Gifford's daughter who's like the football guy and while he was
1:34:14
married he had an affair with this babysitter his wife woke up in the middle of the night and he wasn't in bed
1:34:19
so she went to go find him and found him in the room of their babysitter who was only 16. and because 16 is was the age
1:34:28
of Cassandra is in Massachusetts at the time or whatever he was able to like get off of being like actually in trouble
1:34:34
for it but like he was definitely sleeping with her before then you know like he was absolutely like grooming and
1:34:41
a predator and stuff with his or raped his 14 year old man any and he blamed it
1:34:48
on the booze he said you know I don't drink that was this was in 1997. he believes it on alcohol and drugs and
1:34:54
then he was like I'm gonna get sober he got sober for like maybe six months and on New Year's Eve 1997 so the same year
1:35:01
that it came out that he was sleeping with the nanny he died in a ski accident and like this is one of the dumbest
1:35:08
[ __ ] ways to die so there's this dumb thing that the Kennedys do that the parks and ski resorts have told them not
1:35:15
to do which is playing ski football which is playing football on skis with no pads and no [ __ ] helmet so
1:35:22
Michael Kennedy this is like playing ski football with his family he catches the ball and he
1:35:28
hits a tree and he dies like almost immediately so it's almost like they have no
1:35:34
understanding of like the Harley but like you should because everybody dies
1:35:46
there's a Target on your back anyways and then you play football on skis which
1:35:52
like skiing on its own people die just doing that you don't have to make more complicated totally
1:35:57
why are you even like pushing even further so Michael that is 1997. the seventh kid is
1:36:04
married Carrie she does a lot of activism she seemed fine until I saw that she was married to Andrew Cuomo
1:36:09
which was probably not great so um there's that um she did get in trouble for drunk
1:36:15
driving in 2012. another son Christopher seems fine lives in Chicago there's Matthew Douglas I can't find anything on
1:36:21
them and Rory they're just Rich Kids you know their worry is a filmmaker you know like rich people are
1:36:27
like Sophia Coppola sure fine so as you know so those are all the kids that's
1:36:33
what happened to the kids after JK was assassinated RFK ran for president and as we know he had no
1:36:40
um secret service protection that was not a thing for people voting for president yet and he was in LA accepting
1:36:46
the Democratic nomination when he was killed it was a lone gunman his name was terhan Sirhan he was just denied parole
1:36:53
like two years ago again he will be denied Pearl forever I listened to a
1:36:58
long time ago an entire podcast about it where this guy was talking to his uncle who like devoted his life to trying to
1:37:04
find the conspiracy behind it there's no conspiracy it was just a crazy person so
1:37:10
is there a is there a why to I can't remember the why I'll look it up but I
1:37:16
can't remember but like yeah when he died Ethel was eight months
1:37:22
pregnant with Rory so she had her a couple days after which is terrible and just a couple other like tragedies
1:37:27
around RFK and Ethel's family in 1955 Ethel's parents were killed in a plane crash just like coincidence accidentally
1:37:35
and then also the skequal thing is her nephew Michael skakel was involved he
1:37:41
was convicted of killing his neighbor Martha Moxley and he did it in like 1960
1:37:49
it's like we can maybe talk about it later but it's like a story where like she went to a party and like a rich people's house and he lived with his dad
1:37:57
who wasn't really taking good care of them and they come these like rich kids could do whatever they want and he ended up beating Martha Moxley to death of a
1:38:03
golf club and he got convicted like in 2013 so like 50 years later well he was
1:38:10
convicted of that but he was definitely also a murderer so there's that another one in number eight of eleven is Gene no
1:38:19
of nine what am I doing okay this is the last these are the last ones number of the nine Canada original Kennedy
1:38:25
children so Gene Kennedy is number eight she's born 1928. she died in 2020 she
1:38:30
was the last one to die the last of the kids she was the ambassador to Ireland for a little while she married a man
1:38:36
named Stephen Edward Smith they had two sons and adopted some daughters she had
1:38:42
a son Michael who was uh I think also like something bad happened to him I
1:38:48
can't remember
1:38:54
yeah some rich person way of dying exactly exactly her husband cheated on
1:39:00
her a ton and so like their marriage it didn't last very long like togetherness but they were they stayed
1:39:06
married until his death she was pretty embarrassed about it and kind of like hid it and just kind of like let it happen her son William was involved in a
1:39:13
rape case he was ultimately acquitted but he had been convicted to reap as well so some bad things happened to her
1:39:18
too and then we have the last of the Kennedy children
1:39:24
do you know the last one who are we missing Teddy Teddy Edward Ted Kennedy
1:39:29
was born in 1932. he died in 2009 he was a senator from Massachusetts for over 40
1:39:35
years I wrote lots of drunk driving like a lot like imagine the most drunk
1:39:41
driving that's where we are right now yeah this guy's um yeah I have a lot of conflicting opinions about him but
1:39:47
you're gonna make clear why they exist yes so he
1:39:53
married a woman named Virginia Bennett they had four kids daughter Kara died of a heart attack on a treadmill pretty
1:39:58
young she had had cancer I think another one of his kids had cancer as well they got divorced he obviously like cheated
1:40:04
on her a ton and Virginia was like really just like beaten down by like being the wife of a Kennedy it was it
1:40:10
doesn't sound like a fun job it sounds pretty [ __ ] terrible and he actually had a second wife he married in 1995 her
1:40:16
name was Victoria Reggie and they said that she helped him kind of settle down and like live out like the remainder of
1:40:22
his life and she is actually newly the ambassador to Austria so 10 Kennedy's
1:40:27
Widow is now our ambassador to Austria so it happened like literally this year here are the bad things
1:40:33
the first bad thing that is like not as bad but like a whole thing Ted was also in a plane crash in 1964. he survived
1:40:40
but he was in the hospital for several months with a back injury and one of his aides was killed so I mean don't get in
1:40:46
a [ __ ] plant the Kennedy piece of advice and then the really bad thing was
1:40:51
in 1969 so in 1969 Kent Kennedy is married to his first wife Virginia and
1:40:57
he's also a senator who's already a senator in Massachusetts and he goes out to
1:41:02
drink with his nephews and with his family actually I think that I got this wrong I think he went out to drink with
1:41:08
his nephews night that his nephew was accused of rape and he's part of that story but it's not this this he went to
1:41:15
a party in 1969 with other a bunch of people and he said he would drive a
1:41:21
young woman named Mary Jo kopechne home and by all accounts like she didn't
1:41:27
really drink that much like I don't know if she like trusted him because he was I mean he's a senator you know and he
1:41:32
forever reason drove her home he crashes off of a bridge it into the water he gets out of the car
1:41:39
and he walks 15 minutes back home he passes four houses where he could have
1:41:45
stopped and called for help but he doesn't and he eventually when he
1:41:51
finally tells someone they go and try to find her but she's obviously dead so Mary Mary Jo capacity died in that like
1:41:59
horrifying way his wife had already had two miscarriages and was pregnant and
1:42:05
had a third miscarriage after the trial so just like super traumatic and horrible for everyone wait Taylor
1:42:10
um yeah tell me there's a part of that story that's really really bad so like
1:42:17
when they found when they found when the police finally got the car out and pulled her body out they found there was
1:42:23
like scratch and claw marks on the roof of the car like she was very much alive
1:42:30
when this all happened like he could have actually saved her and then another he could have saved her that's
1:42:37
incredible and this I'm getting this from the last podcast episode in the Kennedys was that apparently he went
1:42:43
back to I don't know the hotel or condo whatever he was staying in and he called the
1:42:49
manager to complain because the neighbors were being loud and playing music too loud this night that this happened that's what he did
1:42:56
oh my God he just killed someone yeah so he ended up not being charged and he
1:43:01
like offered to step down but he didn't step down from the Senate he paid her family ninety thousand dollars and they
1:43:07
got fifty thousand dollars from insurance but they didn't pursue it any further because they just didn't want to like they just wanted to grieve in
1:43:13
private you know like it would have been just like a media circus and then the the last thing
1:43:18
I wrote about this is did you watch succession
1:43:26
oh well spoiler alert this happens session as well where a rich kid gets in a car accident someone dies and
1:43:32
he his family covers it up and it's a lot and he's definitely traumatized by it it's a whole thing but it was
1:43:38
obviously like about to have acquittic and I didn't see them I know there's a movie about it but I haven't really seen that but it's just like
1:43:45
it's a what the [ __ ] are you talking about anybody else there would be in jail forever you can't drunk Drive
1:43:51
someone off a bridge and kill them because the rules that's all I got that's it that's the
1:43:58
ninth and last of the Kennedy kids who none of them had a really
1:44:04
great life despite all of their money and privilege they were definitely I
1:44:09
mean I don't know I was able to believe in curses but like that's a lot of tragedy so
1:44:15
so when I think of um dynastic American families obviously the candies are the
1:44:20
very first one they come to mind feels weird to say it this way but you know I I now would probably categorize
1:44:28
the Bush family as well um in in that in that same similar vein and interestingly enough like it's just
1:44:35
like they just don't have the same like you never hear about them like killing somebody Bush definitely killed someone
1:44:41
driving did she really Laura Bush did oh yeah when she was younger no but I don't know if she was
1:44:48
drunk or whatever but I know that it definitely happened well okay also like you said dynasties yeah look that up I
1:44:55
went to mention like this is also ties into like half of a great and like Genghis Khan all things are saying is
1:45:01
like you cannot have a dynasty because you're gonna have dumb kids you know and like also if you try to have a dynasty
1:45:07
you're gonna have really traumatized kids so like if Joe Kennedy is like we have to win no matter what we're a super
1:45:13
rich we'll pay for you to get out of trouble because you have to win like that doesn't breed
1:45:18
people who are going to not do stupid things you know well it's just like hard to continue
1:45:24
that I don't I don't believe in like a dynastic line it's just impossible because you have like an idiot like I
1:45:29
don't know I would also say that I mean like with anything media related there if there are amazing
1:45:37
kennedies right who like lived a great life and did great things and I mean I'm talking
1:45:44
about the Next Generation Generations removed from this you probably don't hear about it because it's not Sensational right I mean yeah I mean it
1:45:51
did do a lot of good things you're right like the Special Olympics is huge there's like so many nonprofits tied to the Kennedy that's all like really
1:45:57
really great so they definitely did a lot of good but they were like tragic and haunted I think yeah yeah uh that
1:46:06
you should definitely not get I mean these people getting on planes like come
1:46:12
on guys you have to have learned by now that that's just not a mode of transportation to you anymore even if
1:46:18
you're like a person who's like I want to buy my own little plane like you better have major peace with God because that's how you're gonna die like I know
1:46:24
you shouldn't do that it can't be like a side hustle like you have to have an actual job especially like the planes
1:46:30
are like the JFK Junior did the same thing that Kobe Bryant's helicopter pilot did where they were like oh we're
1:46:36
we're not using our instruments we're only going to abuse visual guides if it
1:46:41
doesn't work in the dark or in the fog yeah it's just like so many things that you're like don't do that I kind of feel
1:46:49
for Carolyn Bessette in that situation she wanted to get divorced yeah so I I
1:46:55
was um I I was casually glancing at her um her Wikipedia in the middle of this
1:47:00
and it sounded like the um the media piece like I mean she obviously knew who
1:47:07
she was marrying but I don't think that you know the gravity of it until you're in it and she was just like so not about
1:47:13
the media so not about just kidding Paparazzi all over her like it sounds I
1:47:18
mean maybe they were gonna get divorced for other reasons anyways but um it sounded like that was a huge issue I
1:47:24
think so I think so that reminded me like in the book they were like talking about how if she couldn't leave her apartment because there's like Paparazzi
1:47:30
everywhere and there's actually like one of the first like real Paparazzi in the street pictures is of Jackie Kennedy
1:47:37
have you ever seen that no it's like one where she was like walking out of a hotel and a photographer is like hey she
1:47:43
turns to Smiles because she thought I think she might know him he takes a picture of her and then she's like get super upset but that was like one of the
1:47:48
first like Street Paparazzi pictures you know before it became like everything and I don't know if you've ever seen like a video of what it looks like from
1:47:54
the other side of a Paparazzi thing and like that's horrifying 100 people screaming at you and flashing
1:48:00
in your eyes and all of that so like that sounds terrible yeah my favorite is when celebrities lose it and break their
1:48:06
stuff that's always fun they should man they should yeah well um yeah I don't know I don't know I
1:48:14
don't know if I think this is a lot of episode of all time yeah well I don't think so but I do think
1:48:19
it's I think when you're like when you do so much different so we use so many different things and you have the resource to do so many different things
1:48:25
bad things happen right like I don't I don't have a ski chalet in Aspen to go
1:48:31
skiing play football on so like but if I did maybe that's how it died right exactly yeah no I've never been invited
1:48:37
to play ski football Taylor I do think that this is going to be like a two hour long episode
1:48:43
it is well great job it's our 10 it's our 10th though if you stuck around long enough to
1:48:49
actually hear us come to a close then good for you we appreciate it thank you thanks friends
1:48:57
from your friends thanks everyone for the feedback yeah absolutely
1:49:02
um thank you for everybody who's listening and who's been providing that feedback and checking out our episodes and especially rating us on all the apps
1:49:10
that actually seems to be really helpful so usually Keller calls it out yeah call it out too so please do yeah you'll do
1:49:17
it as far as asks yeah maybe you'll turn it as far as yeah awesome well Taylor will go ahead and wrap up thank you I'm
1:49:24
gonna go ahead and stop the recording thank you all right thanks everyone foreign
1:49:29
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