This is one to sit out if you are scared of the ocean! Today, Farz tells the story behind 'Open Water' and how Tom & Eileen Lonergan went diving at the Great Barrier Reef and never came back. A nightmare.
This is one to sit out if you are scared of the ocean! Today, Farz tells the story behind 'Open Water' and how Tom & Eileen Lonergan went diving at the Great Barrier Reef and never came back.
A nightmare.
Hi Friends! Our transcripts aren't perfect, but I wanted to make sure you had something - if you'd like an edited transcript, I'd be happy to prioritize one for you - please email doomedtofailpod@gmail.com - Thanks! - Taylor
Taylor: I'm going to the eye doctor on Thursday to get new glasses
>> Taylor: In the matter of the people of State of California vs. Orenthal James Simpson, case number BA097. And so, my fellow Americans, ask not.
>> Farz: What your country can do for you.
>> Taylor: Ask what you can do for your country.
>> Farz: Taylor, we are up. We are alive. I'm standing. I'm at my standing desk. It is an exciting day. How are you?
>> Taylor: Good. I'm sitting. I'm sitting on my couch, wrapped in a blanket because it's very windy, and this blanket just came out of the dryer. So I was like, when in Rome sit under a warm blanket.
>> Farz: You are cozed up, cozy, and I'm.
>> Taylor: Making a blanket while I'm sitting in this warm blanket. I mean.
>> Farz: I'm not. I'm not saying anything negative about you, but. Well, I think me and you are two people who becoming older suits us more than being young.
>> Taylor: Absolutely. I mean, I was really good at being young, but I feel like I'm, not. I'm not angry about getting old.
>> Farz: Yeah, yeah. You know, more power to us.
>> Taylor: Yeah. But good for us. Not everybody gets to be old.
>> Farz: Amen. do you want to go ahead and intro us?
>> Taylor: Yes. Hello, everyone. welcome to Doomed to Fail, where the podcast that brings you history's most notorious failures, epic disasters, interesting stories, whatever. I'm Taylor, joined by Fars. Fars. How are you side standing and wearing your glasses?
>> Farz: I'm just getting used to wearing these things. You know, it's funny because you don't realize your vision is anything is off until you wear glasses. And the way I describe it is like, it just turns everything into 4K.
>> Taylor: Yeah, I know I need them. I think I need bifocals. Honestly.
>> Farz: These are bifocals.
>> Taylor: Yeah, that's what I need. I'm going on Thursday to the eye doctor. But in the past, like, six months, my eyesight's gotten a lot worse. But, I mean, I haven't needed them until now. It's bound to happen. So, yeah, I think I'll be okay. I think Miles might need them. So Miles and I are going to go on Thursday. But, yeah, I think it's going to be like. I think Miles might be like, what the hell, mom? Everything's in 4K now. Like you said. Like, I think it might be like, I've needed these for a long time. You're a terrible mother. But we'll see what happens.
>> Farz: The definitely do the buy. So these originally I got, like, regular, Like, I just had one lens in it and it was for rent. reading close. And then I would wear them at a restaurant to read, like, the menu. Then the server would come over and I couldn't see him. It was blurred. And then I'd like have to take them off and then put them back on. Like, it was really like, you gotta definitely do the bifocals.
>> Taylor: That's what I'm gonna do. I'm sure that's what they're gonna tell me that I need, and I'm sure that's what I'll do.
Tom and Eileen Lonergan met at Louisiana State University in 1987
>> Farz: Cool. so I'm gonna tell us a story today. Are you excited?
>> Taylor: Cool. I am.
>> Farz: Okay. So I'm gonna cover a couple that their name is Tom and Eileen Lonergan. And I bet you that nobody knows their name, but everybody probably knows their story. You know their name.
>> Taylor: I, I don't. I. Lanner, again, does not sound familiar.
>> Farz: But you're gonna know their story. so our story starts in 1987 when Eileen Haynes, at that time was a freshman attending Louisiana State University when she met a 22 year old Thomas Lonergan. After dating briefly, they would get married on June 24th of 1988. Like super briefly. Like a year.
>> Taylor: Yeah.
>> Farz: shortly after that, they would enlist in the Peace Corps and they served as volunteers for community development projects in Fiji. I could not find a single instance or record or report of these people being employed at all. Which makes me wonder why did they waste time in college? But they, as far as I can tell, they basically were just like, they struck. They strike me as just free spirits where, like, whatever, I'll just eat whatever I find and then I'll go work somewhere for a weekend and that'll be enough money to like, go to my next place. Like, they're just like that type of couple, you know?
>> Taylor: Yeah. Like, like anyone who thinks that van life is cool.
>> Farz: Yeah.
>> Taylor: It's not. You're living in a van.
>> Farz: I know. I wrote down think Chris Christopher McCandless. Not jet setting. Not like Paris Hilton. Like that. They like to travel, but not the way.
>> Taylor: Yeah, like to travel, Indeed.
In 1998, mass coral bleaching occurred on the Great Barrier Reef
>> Farz: So in 1998, they were on the final leg of their backpacking trip. They're somewhere around 30. so this would have been when Tom was 33 and Eileen was 28. So this is 1998. They're on the final leg of a backpacking trip and they were in Queensland, Australia. And the thing that everyone in the 90s wanted to do while they were in Queensland was to go to see the Great Barrier Reef. I remember this time period, Taylor, because my parents got me the first CD ROM version of like the, Britannica, whatever.
>> Taylor: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Encyclopedia Britannica.
>> Farz: Yeah. And like, the COVID art for all of it was coral reefs. It's like, this isn't real. This can't really exist. Isn't it crazy? Because, like, we had, we had, like, very limited access to, like, the world's knowledge, and you didn't know this stuff really existed. And then I guess the world found out and became a big deal.
>> Taylor: Well, how lucky are we that we got to live in the same time as the Great Barrier Reef before it disappears?
>> Farz: I'm going to talk about that a little bit.
>> Taylor: Yeah.
>> Farz: So in 1981, the Great Barrier Reef was established as a World Heritage site. within a decade or so, scientists would sound the alarms that things like global warming were having an effect on the reef. Specifically El Nino, if you recall El Nino that occurred in 19.
>> Taylor: Or was it like one storm?
>> Farz: well, it's a storm that happens when certain conditions are met, so it can happen again. but the one that happened in 1998 resulted in, like, mass coral bleaching. So what ended up happening was a storm passed right over it, and it was so ferocious that it pulled all the algae that lives on the coral out of the coral, which results in coral bleaching. So.
>> Taylor: And coral bleaching means they're dead. It's just like a scalp.
>> Farz: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. so that basically the long story short is that the whole world basically learned what the Great Barrier Reef was and wasn't obsessed with it. Because I remember this so vividly. It's so great, so old. I remember this incredibly vividly. So in 1998, tourism in this area was incredibly high. About 1.6 million people that year visited the reef and generate about $1 billion worth of income for the local economy. So it was like a big, big deal. There were estimates, that approximately 600 per minute operators were authorized by the Great Barrier Reef Marine Park Authority to operate around 1500 vessels to take people in and out. Scuba diving, doing trip session, daily trips and whatever, like that kind of thing.
>> Taylor: I'm like literally getting nervous while you're talking because I feel like I know what's going to happen and I kind of want to throw up.
>> Farz: Good. Well, I'm glad, I'm glad I can still get to you. So on January 25, 1998, Tom, and Eileen booked a round trip bus ride from a hostel they were staying at, which was 40 minutes away, to the coast where this specific dive company was called the Outer Edge Dive Company. And they were going to go scuba diving at three different dive sites. They were going to start at St. Crispin's and end in Fish City, which sounds really fun.
>> Taylor: That's cute.
>> Farz: the boat they were on carried, a group of 26 passengers, including the Lonergans, about 38 miles northeast of their location in Queensland, deep into the Great Barrier Reef. They would conduct two dives without a hitch. They would do a dive, then they would get everybody on the boat. They would go to a different dive site, they do a dive every on the boat, go to the next site, so on and so forth. So they're on the third dive site by 3pm local time.
>> Taylor: And literally, I'm going to Amazon right now to buy more deodorant, because I just remind you that I need it because I'm getting sweaty.
>> Farz: And. And if any of y'all need deodorant, please go on Amazon and shop there as well.
>> Taylor: Yeah.
>> Farz: so they were at the third dive site at 3:00pm local time. And then around 3:30 is when the dive vessel turned on its engines and started kind of making preparations to head back to shore. it's worth noting that this is also a pretty big tell to anyone who's in the water, because when the engines run on a boat, sound travels pretty far in water. And in theory, you should be able to hear the ship or the boat running its engines. In this case, the ship idled for about 15 minutes before it head back into sea. The safety practices for this day were that anytime a passenger went into or, out of the water, they were supposed to log in or log out by checking their names on or off of the list. They ended up going back to shore with all 24 passengers. M. You see the problem?
>> Taylor: I know you said 26.
>> Farz: So, that's actually the end of the story. So that is the end of the Lonergan story, but we'll continue from there.
Divers discover shoes and backpacks abandoned on MV Outer Edge
So what ended up happening after this was that day, that was the last day trip they were going to have. The crew of this dive company, they reach shore. They noticed that after all the pastures had left, there were shoes and backpacks still on the vessel. And for some reason, they didn't think this was a big deal. They basically were like, somebody forgot it. They took this stuff, put in their office, like, somebody will come back and claim this stuff later.
>> Taylor: Oh, my God.
>> Farz: The crew was then approached by the driver of the bus company the couple had hired to take them back to their hostel. And the driver was like, hey, where are these People. And apparently the crew was super dismissive, saying, hey, they probably just ran off with somebody else. Like, they. They. You know, this is what you do. Like, when you're. You're backpackers, your travelers, you see people, you go. You go do stuff. Two days after the diving trip, employees decided, let's see what's in these backpacks that are just sitting here in this office. And they found passports, money.
>> Taylor: Oh, my God.
>> Farz: travel arrangements, itineraries. Like, things that you don't leave behind casually.
>> Taylor: Yeah, no, of course. This is assigned to always be the best person on the tour and ask a lot of questions so that everyone knows that you are there. Make m eye contact, be BFF to the tour guide.
>> Farz: Be the best person on the tour.
>> Taylor: Just smiling m like, this is so interesting. I have some extra questions for you.
>> Farz: This sounds like something I would.
>> Taylor: You must have worked so hard.
>> Farz: Seriously.
>> Taylor: Yeah.
>> Farz: so authorities were sort of notified immediately. So essentially, the team, this, dive company, realized something's. Something terrible is going on.
>> Taylor: Right? Oh, shit.
>> Farz: They had the hostile information. They called the hostel, and the hostile operator said, we haven't seen this couple since they left to come on your dive. And they're like, oh, my God. Apparently the hostel owner is the one who actually called the authorities. and once the authorities were called, the Coast Guard, other ships in the area all kind of descended in the. Onto the area. This would be about 56 hours or so after they had entered the water. So we're hour 56. So we're on the third solid third day. And eventually, after about four or five days, the search was called off because they're like, scientifically, it is impossible for any human being to have survived out there this long. There's no reason to keep going.
>> Taylor: I mean, if they can't find, like, airplanes in the ocean, they can't find two people, you know?
>> Farz: Yeah, yeah. Well, the good. The good news is, is that this part of the ocean isn't super deep. and also, it's well trafficked, right? Like, you're the Great barrier reef. There's 1500 vessels in and out of the area.
>> Taylor: How big is the Great Barrier Reef?
>> Farz: I don't know.
>> Taylor: Look it up. Someone email us. We don't know.
>> Farz: We don't know. And there's no way that we could find this out. You'd have to pull up your Britannica, CD rom.
>> Taylor: Get that CD ROM going.
>> Farz: So eventually some items belonging to them would, be discovered or washed ashore. so fins, diving equipment, gear, and a diving slate was actually found. And the diving slate is like an oil pen with like a little thing that you could ride on. And it's a way to communicate with someone while you're underwater. In a diving slate, read to anyone who can help us. We have been abandoned on Agent Court Reef by MV Outer Edge. 25 January, 3pm Please help us. Come to rescue us before we die. Help. And, you know, some people thought this could be a hoax. It might not really be theirs. Maybe somebody just planted it. But apparently they did a bunch of testing on the kind of algae that was growing on it, how long that algae would have taken to grow on it, like the kind of equipment that was being used. They determined that, yeah, this is almost certainly theirs. So. And, that's kind of it in terms of we have no idea what really happened to them. The bodies were never actually discovered. But we have theories. So there's three theories here. Theory number one, that is the most probable would be simple dehydration and exposure to the elements. So they obviously had no provisions to stay to sustain themselves while they're adrift. They had no, you know, food or water or anything like, along those lines. Under the best conditions, a human body can go five to seven days before dying of dehydration. So you go that long without drinking. But the conditions under which you could survive or the environment has to be super cold. As in no sweating. So, Taylor, you would be dead immediately with the sweating.
>> Taylor: You're sweating immediately because I'd be fucking terrified.
>> Farz: And, and, and on top of that, you'd have to be exerting zero force. And in that situation, you could survive that amount of time with. Which is the amount of time they basically search for them for. Right. They were like, we're on day eight.
Death due to dehydration or delirium, coroner ultimately determined
Like, it is physically impossible for anybody to be alive. But these guys are in the southern hemisphere during the winter or, sorry, during their summer. And the ambient temperature would have been 73 to 91 degrees with a humidity of 70 to 80 degree, 80% average. So they would have been suffering dehydration like pretty, pretty, pretty quickly.
>> Taylor: Because it was warm.
>> Farz: Because it was warm.
>> Taylor: Yeah, yeah.
>> Farz: And. And they were also in full dive gear.
>> Taylor: Yeah, yeah.
>> Farz: Which they actually took off. At least Eileen took off her dive gear. And there's a bunch of theories as to why she could have done this. It could have been delirium, but it also could have been. She was like, I'm sure I want to die. Like, I just want to, like, just take, you know, the other theory which could also be possible. Has to do with sharks. So the Great Barrier Reef is home to two sharks you do not want to cross paths with. One is the tiger, and the other is the white tip shark. So, tiger sharks are like, pretty much the most dangerous sharks when it comes to humans. It's sort of tied with a great white shark, and it's kind of hard to calculate and determine which one is actually the single most dangerous. The reason being tiger sharks apparently attack humans to eat them. Like, they're not being ambiguous about what they're doing trying to attack you. They want, they want to.
>> Taylor: They're not like, protecting their young or like, whatever. They're just like, you look delicious.
>> Farz: Exactly. So great whites, whenever a human gets bit by a great white, generally speaking, they're trying to test to see if we're edible or not.
>> Taylor: And I kind of feel like the great white thing is overplayed because of Jaws.
>> Farz: Well, great whites actually kill more people than any other shark, so. Oh, they do, true. But it's, it's, you know, it's a little bit different. Like, you know, if you get bit by a great white, like, you could still technically survive because it's not there to eat you. It's there to test whether it can eat you. And then usually they don't because we're not fat enough. They need fatty things to eat. So, like, they go after seals and stuff. But humans generally don't have enough fat for them to be satisfied with it. But a tire shark was so there and just eat you.
>> Taylor: So that, that's so funny because I just can imagine like, getting bit by a, a great way and being like, he thinks I'm skinny.
>> Farz: That's a little compliment that little shark gave you.
>> Taylor: He thinks. He thinks I'm thin. Good.
>> Farz: and then the other part is white tips. So white tips will also attack humans. they're most famous for attacking plane crash survivors and shipwreck survivors. So that's where you will encounter them most from frequently. and so you could, you could run into that. But the. These two. Between these two theories, this is what the coroner ultimately determined. The, if you were to look up the, the, report on their cause of death, it's, possible, de. Death due to dehydration and. Or shark attack is what they. What, what it would say. There's a stupid theory which is that they fake their death. And that is mostly based on what they found of Thomas's writings later on because they had his, like, poetry in his, his his backpack. He had written about wanting to die because he'd seen. What he would say is he was ready to die because he's seen everything that's beautiful in this world and it's time to go. But that just sounds like hippie stuff. Like that just sounds like a stupid hippie, you know, like, it's just like, woozy woo woo. Like, I don't know. There's also no evidence that they would have done this intentionally. Some have pointed out to the fact that, hey, you know what it is? It's kind of like what we were talking about a little bit earlier when we. Before we started recording this podcast. When people say it's. Once it's out there into the ether, it's so easy to find facts for and against that thing. Right? Like, it's out there. And so people will say that, hey, there was these pontoons that were stationed all around the Great Barrier Reefs. The reason was that with all these 1500 vessels that are coming and going from the Great Barrier Reefs, they don't want to go park in the reef because it could be dangerous to the reef. So they have these pontoons that are positioned. You just pull up the pontoon, then you have one anchor point that never moves because they're permanent pontoons. And so people on the Internet are like, well, they probably killed themselves because they could have found one of these pontoons. And if you're in the middle.
>> Taylor: No.
>> Farz: Of the ocean, it's dark, you're hungry, you're thirsty, you're scared.
>> Taylor: There are sharks nibbling at your.
>> Farz: Sharks probably like, at, the very least, sharks hitting you under, hitting your legs underneath you. And then what are you supposed to do? Look off. Look off in the distance and see if you notice like a barge. And m. Maybe that barge is one that you can go. Like, you wouldn't.
>> Taylor: And they have to be. I mean, I can't. I don't think I could tread water for five days. Right.
Authorities investigated the Outer Edge dive company and it was revealed that
>> Farz: You probably. No, no, no.
>> Taylor: Like, they probably retired.
>> Farz: Well, you probably wouldn't be able to tread water for like a day.
>> Taylor: Right? You have to sleep.
>> Farz: Yeah, yeah. So that's at, least my perspective on this is, like, even if there were pontoons like 500ft away, which we know there wasn't, but if there was pontoons even that close to them, can you really blame someone for not finding it?
>> Taylor: Like, I mean, yeah, I also imagine, like, you're moving so much to, you know, like, up and down in a way that, like, even if it's. I don't know. I've even, like, we, went to the beach in Puerto Rico and like, I jumped into a couple of waves. One of them knocked me over. Like, funny. It was, like, fun. But that night, like, several hours later, when I went to bed and closed my eyes, I could feel the ocean moving, you know, like it was it. It. You would be just. I don't know.
>> Farz: I've done closed mask snorkeling before in like, an area of Florida where it's like, you know, you can go touch the bottom. Like, it's not that big of a deal. and I remember thinking to myself when I did that, that I was shocked at how far away the boat was from where I thought it was. I, like, look up and be like, oh, the boat's gonna be right above me. And it's like, oh, my God. I gotta, like, swim quite a ways to get to the boat.
>> Taylor: Yeah, you move so quickly without even knowing even, like when you're. Even when you're like 20ft out in the water and all of a sudden you look up and like, your umbrella is further away than you thought it was. You know, like, that happens all the time too. Yeah.
>> Farz: So authorities in this case, they obviously investigated the Outer Edge dive company and it was revealed that one, they didn't use the login logout method consistently. It was kind of like a choose your own adventure situation with, the crew that was responsible for checking in pastures on that given day. but they also did have a headcount method, which is exactly what it sounds like. And what they found was they double counted a couple that was already on the boat.
>> Taylor: So that's what they did in the movie that.
>> Farz: The Open water.
>> Taylor: Open water. That's also they did in Home Alone. That's how Kevin got left behind.
>> Farz: That's how in part two or one? Part two.
>> Taylor: One.
>> Farz: One. Okay. So they. So the folks, the crew actually thought they had 26 passengers on board. Like, they weren't like sociopaths, like, leaving these people out there. There's a guy, the owner of the vessel and the owner of the company, this guy named Jeffrey Nairn, who he, was the captain that day as well. And he was actually charged with manslaughter, or what they call unlawful killing in Australia. He was acquitted of these charges because his defense argued that keeping counts up to date was a cruel responsibility and it would just get passed around to the different members of the team. Like, the captain's not responsible for everything that happens on the boat. I mean, yes, yes, he Is. I know, but in this case, the argument was in this. Well, yeah, the argument was that in this case you can't hold him responsible because he wasn't actually responsible for doing the activity of counting heads dumb.
>> Taylor: He's responsible for making sure the people who do it are responsible. That's why you are the boss.
>> Farz: Well, the other reason why he wasn't found guilty was because, like, I don't.
>> Taylor: Know if he should go to jail, but I also feel like the captain is nothing but the boss of the ship.
Part of your accountability in any industry has to do with what the standards are
>> Farz: Yeah, well, so here's the other piece of it. So part of your accountability in any industry has to do with what the reasonable standards for your industry are. Right? Like if you're doing like, I'm, making stuff up, but if the reasonable standards to be like an Uber driver is to take 100 hours of Uber driving courses and you did 100 hours, but then you killed someone, then you looked like, hey, like you did all the things you were supposed to do. And then this thing was outside of like the, the industry standards. And that was the case in this situation. There's so many dive companies operating here and they all had the same kind of check in, check out headcount method. And they're like, well, he did what the industry expected him to do. It just didn't work this time.
>> Taylor: Just didn't work that one time. Yeah, I know. I always tell people at work, like, we're not brain surgeons. We can fix anything. You know, like, if anyone messes up, like, we can always fix it. It's not like we can kill someone. But like, jobs like that were like, like being a lifeguard or like those things they make. You're like, if I fucked up, someone could die.
>> Farz: Yeah. Yeah.
>> Taylor: That's scary.
>> Farz: in, in this situation, a fine was levied against Outer Edge dive company and then the company had to go under and it does not exist anymore. which good. Probably, and everybody else get, get better at it. Yeah. They did institute new standards, for the rest of the dive companies that are in the area. I don't recall exactly what that is, but it's probably something along the lines of just pinky promise us that you're counting your passengers.
>> Taylor: Yeah, like, for real this time.
>> Farz: For real this time.
>> Taylor: And I also feel like everybody would be a better passenger because they want to do that thing like, don't you fucking leave me.
>> Farz: Just gotta do the Taylor method, which is ask questions, be as annoying as.
>> Taylor: Possible, and following all the rules. You know what? I'm gonna Go diving. Let me leave my wedding ring with you. And you make sure to give it back to me when I get out on the boat after.
>> Farz: I kind of love that. I mean, I don't know though. The passport didn't work for these guys.
>> Taylor: I know. That's true. I'm writing my name on your hand. You know what? I brought my Sharpie. I'm gonna write my name on your hand, and it says, don't forget Taylor. And then I'll be also thinking, like.
>> Farz: We'Re fortunate that we're kind of distinct looking people. Like, I don't. We don't look a lot like. Well, I don't know. I guess you look a little bit like Christina Ricci. But, like, I don't really look like anybody.
>> Taylor: I said, well, I'm always. This is stupid. But, like, when we do, like, you, like an AI picture of someone might never look like me. And I'm like, I'm just so average. Like, you can't make it look like me. And one husband was like, maybe you're just so above average that no one can even figure it out. And I was like, that's very nice. But, like, it's. I just have the most average face ever. That, like, whenever I do a little, like, emoji, it's always just like, oh, there's a white girl with brown hair.
>> Farz: I just said, you look distinct.
>> Taylor: I know. Thank you. I'm saying I heard that from you and Juan this. This week, and I feel better because I was feeling bad about myself.
>> Farz: There you go. And now. And all you're. All you need now is a compliment, is for that little great white shark bite. And then you'll be good.
>> Taylor: You know what? You know what we could do is I, We could use those stickers that have yours and mine faces on them and bring them. And then, like, I'll cross you out if you're not with me. So I'll be like, here's a picture of me and this is my friend for us. But he's not here, so I'm gonna cross him out. Me. I'm the person that you should make sure gets off this mountain or on this boat or out of this cave. Thank you.
>> Farz: Please, please, we need. We need the co host.
There was a movie about people who went out in open water and died
so, yeah, that's the story. Their bodies were never found. And they made a movie about it. You mentioned the name of the movie. It's called Open Water. Came out, I think, in 2003, 2004, something like that.
>> Taylor: I was also thinking about Open Water too. Have you seen that one?
>> Farz: I haven't seen either.
>> Taylor: Okay, so open water is, like, really scary. It's exactly what you're saying. Like, you know, they, like, you know, or they are, ah, out there a couple days or whatever, and there's like sharks and stuff. And eventually I think that they just, like, succumb. They just, like, let themselves get it, go under. but Open Water two is one where I always think about this when I'm on a boat. It's because it was like kind of a big bow, and it's like a group of friends and a baby, and they're all kind of like hanging out. And the baby. The one of the ladies puts the baby to sleep, and she's standing on the edge of the boat and a guy, like, tackles her and brings her into the water. So they're all laughing, they're all in the water. It's super fun. But they never put the ladder down and they can't get back on the boat and the baby's crying and they just like. It's like a really. I don't think I've watched the whole thing because I got grossed out or I Wikipedia or something, but. Whole point is they jump off the boat and they can't get back on it.
>> Farz: I've never thought of that. Yeah. If you jump off a boat, how do you get back on?
>> Taylor: You gotta have a ladder out because you can't climb up a boat.
>> Farz: So what do they do?
>> Taylor: I can't remember. Happens at the end.
>> Farz: So I actually thought about watching open water for this, but I realized, like, it's all fake because we never. We never found the bodies, but we have no idea what happened to them.
>> Taylor: I mean, I feel like it's a pretty good guess. They definitely do the, like, they show the counting thing and then, like, they're like, spend a little bit of time being like, oh, they'll come back for us, you know, like, they probably, for at least a couple hours, were like, I'm sure they're on their way, you know?
>> Farz: God, when you lose that hope, that's gonna be the worst part.
>> Taylor: Mm. In the beginning, you're like, there's literally no way they're gonna wait two days before they open up our backpacks, you.
>> Farz: Know, or even like a minute after they realize the backpacks were there. But yeah. Okay. Open Water two Sounds fast. Anymo. Okay.
>> Taylor: Yeah.
>> Farz: Cool. Well, that's my story.
Taylor clarified some stuff that we said about chickenpox and shingles
Taylor, you got anything for us?
>> Taylor: I do, actually. So it's Wednesday today, but we released our episode on Polio on Monday. And then I released episode with my dad today. Did you listen to it?
>> Farz: I didn't listen to it actually. And I was gonna say that we probably should wait to release this on like Thursday.
>> Taylor: Sure, whatever. but, but my family liked it, so that was cute. But Kincaid, my brother, clarified some stuff that we said about chickenpox and shingles. So if you have had chickenpox as a kid, then you can get shingles as an adult. If you did not have chickenpox, you cannot get shingles. But if you have the chickenpox vaccine, you have that tiny chance of getting shingles. So if you' never exposed to chickenpox and you get it as an adult, it's. I think it's worse when you're older. But it's not shingles. It's different. It's chickenpox. So once you've had chicken pox, you, you, you are susceptible to getting shingles, but you can't get the shingles vaccine until you're 50.
>> Farz: Do you get shingles before you're 50?
>> Taylor: Yes, but you can't get the vaccine until you're 50. But then, then you're vaccinated from all of it. Because then I remember I had the chickenpox when I was little for sure. Like I remember it. My parents remember it. But when I was pregnant with Miles, they did a blood test and they were like, oh, you need the chickenpox vaccine because you're not immune. And I was like, okay, I'll take it, whatever. But, immunity didn't last.
>> Farz: Sorry you said that. So the kids don't have vaccines for chickenpox, they just have to get it?
>> Taylor: No, no, they have the vaccine now.
>> Farz: They do. Okay.
>> Taylor: But my brothers. So there's five kids in my family. I'm the oldest. Decker's 10 years younger than me. Kincaid's 12 years younger than me. And by the time Decker and Kincaid were born, they got the vaccine. But Blair Stratton and I all got chickenpox.
>> Farz: Got it. Got it. You know, lucky them. M. We're lucky. Yes. We went the tough route.
>> Taylor: You know, I would say that oatmeal bath, it's a lot.
>> Farz: Yeah, I got a bike. I got one of those huffies, that has, a radio on it. It was like the coolest thing back then. Nobody had that.
>> Taylor: Cute.
>> Farz: Yeah, that was very cool.
>> Taylor: I, ah, love that for you. Very stranger things of you.
>> Farz: sweet. Anything else to report?
>> Taylor: No, that's it. we're growing on TikTok. Because I'm doing like five TikToks a day because I'm going over all of our episodes. I don't know if you noticed. And then I'm slowly. I don't know, I'm not either but we are. And so I'm slowly like reposting our tech talks onto Instagram or whatever. But I'm getting some engagement over there. People have been like, oh cool, I'm gonna download it, whatever. So I'm just kind of recapping all of our episodes. Gonna take me my whole life. It's on episode seven. There's just so many of them. But, just to get a little bit more out there. So I'm doing that and if you have any suggestions or ideas we got a couple suggestions in on Instagram. so thank you for that friends and let us know. Doomed to fail podmail.com and doomed to fail pod on all the socials.
>> Farz: Sweet. I'll go ahead and cut things off. Thank you, Taylor.
>> Taylor: Than.