This week Farz goes back across the pond to tell the story of the murderous pairing of Ian Brady and Myra Hindley. These two attacked and killed children across Manchester and buried them in the moors (which is British for super big field). A Neo-Nazi found his match in a girl who would do anything for him, takes one to know one. This is the story of the Moors Murders. Then, Taylor tells the truly American tale of Lizzie Borden and her axe (maybe!?! We don’t know that she did it for sure and we will never know!). On a Tuesday morning on a busy street Andrew and Abby Borden were brutally murdered with an axe before noon! Could it have been their daughter? Everybody together! Lizzie Borden took an axe and gave her mother forty whacks. When she saw what she had done, she gave her father forty-one. https://www.instagram.com/doomedtofailpod/ https://www.facebook.com/doomedtofailpod Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@doomedtofailpod
This week Farz goes back across the pond to tell the story of the murderous pairing of Ian Brady and Myra Hindley. These two attacked and killed children across Manchester and buried them in the moors (which is British for super big field). A Neo-Nazi found his match in a girl who would do anything for him, takes one to know one. This is the story of the Moors Murders.
Then, Taylor tells the truly American tale of Lizzie Borden and her axe (maybe!?! We don’t know that she did it for sure and we will never know!). On a Tuesday morning on a busy street Andrew and Abby Borden were brutally murdered with an axe before noon! Could it have been their daughter?
Everybody together!
Lizzie Borden took an axe
and gave her mother forty whacks.
When she saw what she had done,
she gave her father forty-one.
https://www.instagram.com/doomedtofailpod/
https://www.facebook.com/doomedtofailpod
Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@doomedtofailpod
Photos of Lizzie & the Borden home via the public domain
Borden house via historicaltranscripts.com
Ian Brady and Myra Hindley via Wikipedia
Some Sources:
Hi Friends! Our transcripts aren't perfect, but I wanted to make sure you had something - if you'd like an edited transcript, I'd be happy to prioritize one for you - please email doomedtofailpod@gmail.com - Thanks! - Taylor
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[Music] as a matter of the people of State of California versus Ortho James Simpson case number ba-09
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[Music]
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reporting this computer reporting is in progress and we're alive
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so yeah okay let's get started welcome to I don't need a clap welcome to Doom
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to fail the red fighting podcast where we explore historic and true crime story about red flags that we're being ignored
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I'm forced joined here by Taylor hi Taylor hi we don't have to like super rush I'm fine
0:42
so aren't you what are you doing after this you're doing a recital no I'm going to Palm Springs for a direct drag queen
0:49
bingo with Girl Scouts but it doesn't start until one and we're totally fine
0:54
so I don't have to leave for like two hours so it's fine if Fox News heard you
0:59
were doing that you'd be the most famous woman in history of America I Love the Girl
1:06
Scouts the Girl Scouts are very Progressive like they have God in their pledge but they're like you don't have
1:11
to say it's no big deal like they are so super cool with it the Boy Scouts are like you can be any religion as long as
1:17
you're a religion and you're like what so um the best it's real gross yeah
1:24
um do we want to share the amazing news that happened this week with our listeners
1:30
what happened Pat Robertson died oh God I know how [ __ ] awesome the world
1:37
literally got a little bit brighter just like a little bit better I know I'm so
1:44
I said this on my Instagram but you know for me it's such a bummer that like I
1:49
feel like when you die it's just like lights out and there's no like realization but I wish I was like
1:55
but also like did he really believe that [ __ ] I don't know what piece of [ __ ] he just wanted to steal money from people
2:00
hold on I'm looking up my favorite Pat Robertson quotes about feminists abortionist and
2:07
gays that we did 9 11. Ah the gays are the ones that did 9 11. that's what it was
2:13
so gay what a gay day yeah God what
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scumbag excuse me is the influence it's not the like okay one person having that
2:27
much of an outsized influence on like she's like so much of like the shitty
2:33
things about our society is because people listen to them I know he goes okay so here's what he said he
2:40
goes this is Pat Robertson's quote I really believe that the pagans and the abortionists and the feminists and the
2:45
gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an ultra alternative lifestyle the ACLU people for the
2:52
American way all of them who have tried to secularize America I point the finger in their face and say you helped this
2:58
happen he's about 9 11. ACLU I mean like
3:04
I do feel like the ACLU waste money because I donated 20 like 10 years ago and they send me a letter every single
3:09
day so I'm like there's no way that the amount of male leaves at me costs less than 20 but and then then you have
3:17
people all now all the Republicans out there or whatever being like we don't want any
3:24
diversity we don't want any like other Lifestyles besides our own which sucks
3:30
do you know what um David Pell does that I think is like really funny is he will
3:36
donate a dollar to Republican candidates and then have them spend all their money
3:42
mailing in letters asking for money do you ever want all those K-pop fans
3:48
bought all the tickets to Donald Trump's event yes free tickets so they like reserved all
3:54
of them so they thought a thousands of people were coming and like not thousands of people were coming so good so good glad glad Pat Robinson is dead
4:02
yes yes the world is a much better place cool let's go ahead and Dive Right In so
4:09
who goes first today I believe you do I do okay
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and okay so I didn't I forgot to think about what my drink was gonna be but I
4:20
think I have one yeah um my drink is like old milk
4:28
like imagine that it's hot and the milk has not been in the fridge for a while
4:33
kind of sounds good you know no it doesn't it's gonna make you sick with some sugar yeah beat the curds up
4:40
with some sugar um no okay I am going with a beer that I
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never find but I was in love with when I was living in Florida bonningtons it is
4:51
a Manchester beer you saw that before wait did I do oh my god I've done Manchester before haven't I yes because
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you know why I know that I have at one point I was like oh I'm gonna write down a list of what what the drinks are and I
5:03
only wrote down one thing and the one thing I wrote down was boddington's I think I even have it right now here yeah January 21st boddington's Brewery in
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Manchester Taylor is holding up her sorry to show me this that's an
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incredible Taylor I'm gonna write it today's date as well just right
5:20
times two and then for today's date I have this whole page for times that you mentioned boddington so Rose
5:26
boddington's is so good it's so hard to find I don't know why it's so hard to find but it's awesome it's delicious so
5:33
I am I picked Bobby tins because my story I guess like the last one is based in the UK
5:43
it's based in Manchester so God I'm so it's weird I totally friend I
5:49
did that other story that was in Manchester yeah memory memories uh can you do the whole thing in a Manchester
5:55
accent I don't know what a Manchester accent is I don't either I feel like I want to go a little bit Boston be like Manchester
6:03
yeah yeah the part the problem is that if you don't nail it you just sound
6:08
stupid so I'm actually gonna go a bit historic
6:15
with this one so I'm gonna do a really really old-timey one it's a super super famous one it's a super famous crime
6:21
that happened about 60 years ago in Manchester uh despite how famous it is I really didn't
6:28
know much about it I don't know how much you know about it but I'm gonna be discussing the more murders with Brady and Myra Henley are you aware of these
6:34
guys a little bit I feel like I know weird stuff about Myra Henley later in life is she still alive no no no she
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died a long time ago like 2005 or something okay um I know a little bit tell me more yeah
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so you probably know because I know we again we have the
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exact same podcast on it so like you probably also listen to the Fred and Rose West episode on last podcast and
7:01
Rose West ended up in like a sexual relationship at one point with Myra because that's the thing yeah they were
7:08
the two most notorious women in UK history and Myra's like blonde right or like she was
7:16
um yes that's that's the thing that happened later in life that I remembered okay exactly exactly so she was not
7:22
blonde naturally but everybody you find of her she is blind but I'll explain why that was here no one really is yeah yeah
7:28
I'll explain why that what it is I'm gonna meet my phone so people can not hear that and I'll continue on so
7:34
we're gonna start with our main antagonist of the story wait yeah antagon antagonist is bad
7:40
right protagonist is good yeah yeah they're antagonists they're not good people so okay Taylor per usual I'm gonna go ahead
7:48
and I'll just say that we are probably gonna disagree on a lot of things here I am going to err on the side that I
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thought Myra was a complete and absolute monster and Society seems to think that like she was just some poor put upon
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girl and Ian kind of remembered her and it's like
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it's a crazy crazy whatever you tell me what you think about it when we get to it but okay we're gonna start with our
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story with Ian Brady so Ian was born in Glasgow Scotland in 1938 he was raised
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by his mother and pretty much didn't know who his father was of all he was a pretty precocious child and he
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was considered above average intelligence so he was accepted into a gifted school that was called Sean lands Academy
8:31
he would do these like stupid Petty crimes like stealing things here and there and ultimately at 15 years old he
8:38
ended up leaving and starting to work in various odd jobs I guess like back then I mean yeah it makes sense right like
8:45
nine-year-olds were too many sweeps so I guess you're at 15 you just retire out of school and just start working makes I mean that's what you do in Old Time
8:51
England I guess yeah there's like either you you go you go to the university if you're rich other than that you just like get a job in the coal mine
8:59
I would have been a great Chimney Sweep I think that would have been so fun with a page Boy hat I'd wear a vest and I had
9:05
the pocket watch already so I could wear the pocket watch and the best and a page boy had and do like a little chimney thing well that's definitely something
9:12
you would have had to do when you're a child because you're way too big now to do that you think I'm too big yes I don't know I've never been in a chimney
9:17
but I feel like you're very broad you're broader than a chimney but also I have no idea
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the body of a nine-year-old boy damn it though these opportunities are a ruined
9:32
for me uh so ultimately at some point uh Ian would end up moving back in with his
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mom and at that point she will have left Glasgow for Manchester or England and picked up a new life there again he
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would just keep doing these stupid Petty crimes and keep getting locked up over and over again at around 19 years old
9:52
he's released from jail he was apparently there for a couple of years apparently he got like he had bad treatment in jail like he was
9:59
he got the [ __ ] kicked out of the joke I mean he's a destroying little kid right and um and he decided when he got
10:05
released from Jello okay that's it I'm gonna button up I'm gonna go on the straight and arrow I'm gonna I'm gonna
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figure my life out this is going to jail and do these Petty crimes that is not the route for me and so he's not gonna
10:16
be bad at it if he keeps going to jail um I don't know if I committed crimes when I was 15 I'd probably go to jail too I better get away with a lot of
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crimes now like what should I do should I embezzle something went bad I bet that I can embezzle a billion a million
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dollars yes remember when I put that posted on your desk that said to do plan murders
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limit murders
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um okay uh so he taught himself how to do what's
10:46
called um they call it bookkeeping which I think just means accounting right yeah yeah so he self-taught himself
10:52
bookkeeping he would study at the library and do all this again he was a really precocious kid he would read a
10:57
lot and all that stuff and ultimately he ended up getting this job at some random Chemical Company doing their accounting work
11:03
he would be really into Nazi stuff so
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so you know it's funny because it is post Nazi this is post World War II
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right this is right after World War II okay they just lost but it's time well
11:22
okay but but so okay so at this point when I was researching this I was like okay yeah obviously like World War II
11:28
ended like five six seven years ago and you're in England who was just carpet
11:33
bombed by Nazis so you probably have some fascination with who were these
11:38
people what was this all about like I understood it at this point more of like um
11:44
he's a historical dude who wants to know what happened not like he likes Nazis
11:52
later on going back to the blonde hair thing with Myra it changed yeah
12:00
so there was one other thing that I couldn't verify because multiple sources said different things about this
12:06
multiple sources would say either he did or he didn't torture and kill a ton of
12:12
cats and dogs this time this kid I'm leaning towards no and I'm actually
12:17
basing that off of what Ian himself said because later on we'll find out that he was pretty vocal about everything else
12:23
it was kind of like it was kind of like when Jeffrey Dahmer was caught and they were like did you do this one he's like no I mean I told you everything I would
12:29
have told you if I did that one it's like I have no more secrets yeah exactly yeah exactly so like in this case Ian's
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the one who's like no I like love the animals like I never would have heard an animal and everybody else was like no he
12:41
was a serial killer who like killed all these dogs and did all this it's like he probably didn't we probably you probably
12:47
just made that up because you're like we have to have some pattern here yeah I don't know yeah or maybe he like killed
12:53
a dog but like an old-timey way you know like you didn't like take your dog to the vet to be put down
12:59
yeah you just hit it with a rock and so that you know what's funny is um is Luna's sleeping right there uh Luna
13:05
We're not gonna kill you so okay Taylor tell me if I'm wrong about this so Joe
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our friend Joe Conti is here visiting in Austin incredible known each other like
13:18
at this point this configuration people have donation of like 10 11 years um and Joe shows up and he's like I'm going to
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take him I'll bring you out in East Austin if you're in awesome we're gonna go to Kitty Cohen if you're playing with that and then lahali and Joe is like my
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only request is don't bring your dog you shouldn't bring your dog we're going out when I get time don't need a dog I was
13:39
like there's no chance of operating my dog like why on Earth would I go out and not bring it makes everything in
13:44
Austin's outside everybody brings their dogs like why would I not and like it just blew his mind that I would bring my dog and it's like no of course like and
13:51
I did and I did it was a great time and she socialized and she had a great time it was it was really fun but I do think
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that now we in fantasize dogs in a way that they probably didn't when Ian was
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growing up in England and so he probably did just fashion dogs ahead in with a baseball bat so exactly that's what
14:10
that's that's exactly what I was thinking like it's different it's different it's definitely different that
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was the most long-winded way of just circling back to he just cracked the dog's skull open at some point so we are
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going on to so that's our wrap up of Ian Brady just generally speaking smart
14:27
precocious might be crazy might not don't sometimes the [ __ ] up yeah yeah
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Myra is our second person in this equation and she was actually born in Manchester or just outside of the little
14:39
town in nineteen in 1942 so that would make her four years younger than Ian
14:46
it sounds like her childhood was mostly just punctuated with abuse in general poverty her dad sounds like he was like
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a military bro and kind of expected Myra to be super super tough and just like aggro and all that
14:58
um you know it's interesting because like psychologists after the fact would say
15:05
that the way her dad treated her or told her how to treat others made her
15:10
um desensitize to violence and emotionally distant and this stuff but like really all it was was like Hey if
15:17
someone hits you you hit him back twice as hard like it was one of those like that's what it actually read like it wasn't like uh like
15:24
any time you're upset react to it aggressively with violence like that's not what it was it was it was don't
15:30
don't be uh stepping whatever because words
15:36
thank you um I feel like have you seen the stuff that Arnold Schwarzenegger has been
15:42
saying lately about his dad no um because he's pretty much like my dad
15:47
was like a Nazi because it was that time and he came home and he was a terrible terrible broken person and he like beat
15:55
the [ __ ] out of us and was an alcoholic because of the trauma that he went through and so you know he was like he's like his caution to America is like stop
16:02
being [ __ ] because you go to ruin generations of people you know with with this like anger and this hate like no
16:08
matter what happens like in in the worst case which is like World War II and concentration
16:13
camps and all those things are like best case like you have these like lives they're just like horrible and like abusive and everyone's angry so even on
16:20
like the you know English side where they won like the trauma that those dads went through and then they had to like
16:26
come home and like even on our side too like my great grandma had three brothers who went to World War II
16:31
um came home never did anything else they were they were PTSD to the end of their lives they lived in her mom's
16:37
attic they called him the three kings they just hung out in the Attic because what they saw was so awful they couldn't do anything else that's wild you know so
16:45
one thing coming home from that like one thing that that I've learned a lot of recently is um ketamine treatment so
16:52
apparently in Austin there's a lot of these ketamine clinics that apparently are really really good for working through is your shirt say future Forks
16:59
it does foreign
17:06
anyway also your story there just reminded me of that one scene in um oh God Schindler's List where they're
17:14
burning the piles of body at Auschwitz and that one Nazi Soldier takes us out and just starts screaming into the sky
17:20
because like I don't know it feels like as a human you know when everything's wrong even if
17:26
you're a Nazi yeah and I mean so many of them had to be I mean they're all bad 100 but some of them they were on so
17:33
much meth and so many drugs and so drunk and all these things to be able to do those inhuman things Yeah well yeah
17:39
[ __ ] sorry okay going back to the future corpses awesome sure we should make it
17:45
I'm gonna figure out where you bought that and buy that shirt it's from a woman her her Instagram is the good
17:51
death she writes she's a former mortician and she has a YouTube channel called ask a mortician and she wrote a
17:56
great book called when smoke is in your eyes and it's about death and it happens to bodies and it made me feel fine made me feel much better about
18:03
death it's Caitlin nobody at the death so Holloway Caitlyn and get some shirts
18:10
because that is awesome yeah okay back to my rub okay overall that's basically her
18:16
childhood poverty that is kind of an abusive [ __ ] but also he wants her to stick up for herself she develops like a
18:23
knack being kind of like a tough girl but that's mostly it um she was mostly normal like everybody who knew her thought that she was
18:29
well liked and cool and like there's no nothing wrong with her basically at this point so and and that's the part of it
18:35
that annoys me later on when people were like like it was all Ian that did it's like dude like
18:40
I don't know how many girls I've been with but none of them could ever have convinced me to like
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kill somebody like nobody's that Charming right yeah okay so at 18 years
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old so um or when Myra's 18 years old she finally meets Ian for the first time at that chemical company that Ian was a
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bookkeeper for Ian would have been like 22 to 23 give or take at this time
19:05
he would eventually ask her out on a date and they would start going out together
19:10
um it was weird like the Wikipedia article on this said that like they would just go to x-rated movies and then
19:15
go back to his apartment like it was like what like that was your date yeah
19:21
that's a weird first date if you're like this is our Jam then do
19:28
whatever you want but if it's your first date I feel like you should go out for ice cream but I don't know I feel like it needs to be like three years into
19:34
dating when it's like let's just start casually every Friday going to an expert in the theater like it's like what but
19:41
it sounded like this is almost like close to the very beginning it's like they would just go to these movies together uh and this is where the Nazi
19:49
thing comes back into effect because Ian would constantly talk to Myra about Nazis and like that's where like it
19:56
flipped for me which is like this is probably more January 6 than just
20:02
interest in history type of thing and then like you mentioned earlier so
20:08
the very first photo if you look up my if you Google Myra Henley the very first photo of her is blonde hair like Crimson
20:15
deep red lipstick is what shows up it's gonna be black and white you don't know it but it's gonna be crimson red and
20:21
she was a brunette like she wasn't born that way like she she did this for Ian
20:27
because I guess like nothing specifically said everybody he had this like obsession
20:32
with like the Aryan concept and
20:38
I guess Myra really liked him a lot and wanted him to be impressed with her and so she wanted to look more traditionally
20:43
Airy and so she did this to herself so just like yeah one statement that Myra would later say
20:52
when she was um after she'd been incarcerated whatever she said that Ian could have told her
20:57
anything this is a quote that the Earth was flat that the moon was made of green cheese that the sun rose in the west and
21:04
I would have believed him like that's a I guess like I guess type of person like
21:10
apparently Ian was really really Charming like other people would also say this God and like he had that Psychopathic thing where he would just
21:15
grip your attention and make you want like just follow him wherever he went so one thing I wrote here was like again
21:23
nobody would ever have convinced me that I'd never liked anybody enough I mean I
21:28
don't know maybe I've never liked anybody enough that's what it is I've never met anybody that I liked enough who asked me to kill somebody that I
21:33
would maybe I will one day but I haven't yet yeah I don't know if I would I feel like
21:40
if you or if one told you to like tell your neighbor right now would you do it no
21:45
okay when I go to jail and I have children to take care of if one said he was going to kill the neighbor but you'd
21:52
have to help bury the body would you do it I don't think I don't know I mean I feel like then potentially
21:58
because I'd be scared slippery slope I'd be scared you know so it starts this is exactly how it starts
22:05
we're gonna be very afraid like object objectivity still exists like whether
22:11
like okay I'm in love with this person they're amazing they're great whatever they're still objective truth and objectively it is wrong to do these the
22:18
things that these people end up doing and like people later on are like poor my report it's like no not poorly she
22:23
still had objective reality to contend with yeah was he abusing
22:33
punching a woman in the face was just like normal discourse like that was not like I mean I would not say they had an
22:39
abusive relationship outside of like whatever was normal then which isn't that yeah today would be an
22:45
abusive relationship back then it was like he just loves me that much you know well that's part of it too I feel like
22:51
right right so yeah it actually had like part of the
22:57
relation was also like just like they started veering into like stuff that me and you like to talk about which is like a lot of True Crime War stuff like I
23:04
actually think they would have been fans of our show if they were still alive because they start like when you go to like the library and just constantly
23:10
check out books and they oh man I didn't write it down what's that what's that uh the Marquita sod book
23:17
I don't know I'm gonna look it up 120 days of sod I think it's called it's a crazy
23:23
intense they made a movie about that it is a crazy intense like torture porn book 120 days of Sodom yep there it is
23:31
yeah and it's a movie too it's super graphic like I don't I wouldn't really recommend anybody watching it's very
23:36
torture and like sexual well it's it's gross but like that's the kind of things
23:42
that are into they're constantly checking out books on stuff like that or uh other true Prime uh books that it
23:48
would constantly be digesting and involved in so that's why I thought like hey maybe they'll be our fans I don't know yeah and all that again it's fine
23:54
as long as you don't actually murder people I know that's the part of the word gets tough it's like it's like you
24:00
wonder because like me and you consume this kind of media and I mean we're totally innocent like it's not it's not
24:07
those things that make it bad it's the events that happen afterwards that make it like that and on those events so I'm
24:15
gonna read out what these guys did and it's gonna be a little bit numb because
24:20
it happens so much it's like who gives a [ __ ] like you've murdered this kid and
24:25
killed that kid right now let's say it happened so much that it's almost like just it's
24:30
meaningless so sorry if it comes across that way obviously people's lives mattered but whatever like it having
24:36
forever go and they just did this a lot so in 1963 this would be two years after
24:42
they started dating did Ian got obsessed with Leopold and remember that case yeah yeah yeah yeah
24:47
yeah yeah so for those that don't know this was about like basically two American deities who thought that they
24:53
were smart enough to commit the perfect crime and they were obviously caught and arrested yeah they were not they were
25:00
caught very quickly very quickly Ian and Myra at this time moved into Myra's
25:05
grandmother's house which is awesome that's a really cool thing to do when you're a man in your mid-20s to live with your girlfriend's grandmother and
25:11
Ian at this point he literally learned nothing from his
25:17
obsession with the Leopold look case so the entire premise of it was like if you
25:26
are of a certain level of intelligence you can out smart comes down smart everybody else and that's that wasn't
25:33
true they very much did not do that yeah they did the opposite they got caught in
25:38
extended to death immediately um Ian thought that he would do better with them so he literally learned nothing he
25:45
was like I hear you I see you I can do better on this he wanted to talk yeah
25:51
how much crime is that you know people being like oh yeah that guy got caught but I totally wouldn't get caught
25:57
it's probably it's quite yeah I mean it's a competition thing at that point it's like a sport at that point
26:04
so he decided he's gonna Commit This Perfect Crime and he starts kind of
26:10
figuring out like how Mario can get involved in this like again like I I don't know how she
26:17
like she seems so bought into anything he said it just felt like it was a natural progression they would end up in this position uh in this case Myra was
26:24
kind of central to what ends up happening which is why I don't find her it's like this victimless or blameless
26:30
person she was a key component of this so Ian tells Meyer that he has a plan
26:36
they're gonna run a van and Mario's gonna drive around town Ian's gonna follow her in a motorcycle and when he
26:42
sees someone that he wants to abduct he's gonna flash the lights in her and
26:48
she could pull over and ask a victim if they want to take a ride so it's a weird ask yeah yeah it's again I
26:56
don't know where you find these people so in July of 1963 they put this in action and they end up kidnapping a 16
27:03
year old classmate of Myra's sister a girl named Pauline Reed this is the very first one
27:09
show so Myra pulls over offers her a ride and then she says yes gets in the
27:14
vehicle because she recognize her she knew right why wouldn't she yeah and
27:19
Myra says hey I got to take a detour I want help finding this glove like some luxury beautiful glove I have I lost it
27:27
and I need help finding it and the girl's like okay fine I'll help and so they take her to eating a Myra's home
27:34
Ian then somehow convinces Pauline to go
27:40
into the Moors and look for this luxury beautiful glove they have and he ends up
27:46
coming back alone that's my real story or Ian's gonna say something a little
27:52
bit different but that's the story that we're going to run with for now he we know for a fact ultimately based on
27:57
confessions that he would he when he took her back there he raped her and then stabbed her badly enough to almost
28:03
decapitate her like he pulled an OJ like it was one of those oh my God and Ian would claim that Meyer was
28:10
actually there the entire time she took part in the sexual assault she took part in the stabbing and that's not the story
28:16
that Myra tells and I don't know who to believe they're both handbags so who's to say right
28:22
yeah this is just gonna keep rolling on five months later they offer right to a 12 year old named John tombride they
28:30
again say they have to go searching for something and this time uh they say they
28:36
got to go directly even more instead of the house and once they get there Ian takes John out of the car again sexually
28:43
assault some and stuff it's just like it's so sterilized the way I'm praising
28:48
it but it just happens over and over how many different ways can you say raped and like
28:53
this is the same thing over and over how big how big is the more
28:59
you know Taylor I was going to ask you if you knew what a more is I do know what Amore is do you know what Amor is I
29:05
I Googled it so I know what Amore is yeah it is like a big expanse of Rolling
29:14
Green Hills yeah that's yeah you know like Scottish land you'd imagine I think of Moore's I
29:20
think of um in Wuthering Heights there's a lot of Moors Heathcliff always runs across the
29:26
Moor looking for for her and then also I bet it's very foggy because my sister
29:32
studied abroad in Brighton and my brother and I went to visit her and every morning we would go on a fog walk
29:38
because it was so foggy him and I would go out to like just like the field that like the um they would like play soccer
29:43
in or whatever but we would be three feet apart and couldn't see each other it's crazy so we were like yeah like frog walk and like running it was really
29:50
fun but um I don't know I imagine it was foggy too yeah yeah of course England right yeah it's so the legal definition
29:58
for more is a tract of open uncultivated Upland
30:04
so it's like to me I was just saying it's kind of like a wetter version of Joshua Tree it's kind of what it feels like yeah so that's what it is and
30:10
people get murdered in Joshua Tree and disappeared in there all the time so that actually gives me context you you
30:16
and Juan just taking out your neighbors left and right I mean several hikers a year disappear um they probably just get lost and died
30:22
they get lost yeah yeah they for sure get lost um so okay so we're at John's club right
30:29
so seven months after he's been killed and disposed over the Moors Myra comes across a 12 year old named Keith Bennett
30:35
she asked him to help load stuff into her vehicle very Ted bundy-esque and then offers to take him home after which
30:41
she does or she says she's going to do they end up he gets up getting in the car and this is a part of it where like
30:47
I'm like dude she's not just some poor put upon woman like I'm not maybe I'm
30:52
sexist towards myself but like if a man asks me for help I'm not I'm not even gonna slow down my walk to offer to help
31:00
some random strange man but if a girl asks me for help I was like okay like sure like
31:06
there's a trust there that you don't have with a strange man I think that that's I think that's true I think
31:11
that's definitely true that like a woman I think that's why like Ian and other
31:17
people have had women partners in crime like this because it's easier to get a kid in the van if a
31:24
woman asks them and that's definitely true I also think that Ted Bundy would have 100 murdered me because I would have definitely helped him
31:30
he's not that good looking like I don't even care I would have helped him he would have been like hey can you help me I have this thing I'd be like oh sure no
31:36
problem like it wouldn't have crossed my mind I'll probably still help him today and then then I'd be dead and I'd be like [ __ ] I knew this was gonna happen
31:41
but I did it anyway that's why you don't help anybody I know that sounds really mean but it's like dude like
31:47
everybody's out to get you not the answer it's not the thoughts of a broken man
31:53
um so going back to Keith so she Myra ends up taking Keith to the her home
32:00
hornian's home and Ian asked him to go help find which is the Grandma's home the Grandma's home he's not home
32:06
apparently uh and again Ian asked her to go or ask him to go help him find this
32:12
beautiful glove he lost in the more there he again sexually assaults Keith instrumentalism to death
32:18
next was Leslie Ann Downing this would have been seven months after he's like they actually have like kind of like a
32:24
pretty protracted you know Co-op period so people in town like something's happening
32:31
so later everything is pinned on these guys because like this was not the only these
32:39
were not the only kids going missing like there was like a lot of kids going there they're probably all just dying
32:44
sweeping chimneys and just like their bodies were never found but like a lot of kids were going missing and I'll
32:49
discuss this later on because police are like wait a minute we got these people just keep killing children and we just
32:56
got arrested them there's like another 30 missing kids maybe they killed all these we don't know they didn't really
33:02
draw that Extinction themselves until they were caught so we're settlements after Keith Ian and
33:07
Myra were shopping and they noticed a girl a 10 year old uh Leslie and Downing they dropped their bags in front of her
33:14
and asked her to help she's like sure I'll help because she's 10. right yeah I know and they're like okay thanks for
33:21
helping can you help get this in our car it's like okay and like can you help get us in this in our house they're like
33:26
okay and so she's like it's so [ __ ] up dude like using the trust the inherent trust that
33:33
a child puts in people against them like it's so whatever and we've had a Sephora
33:38
that's what you tell kids you tell kids like a grown-up does not need your help yeah like if a grown-up is looking for help like you say no it would be polite
33:45
like whatever but like don't help them like go and passage your help they can find another grown up they can use they can call someone like that's a big thing
33:51
they have taskrabbits robes have taskrabbits yeah so Trump still need a 10 year old to help them move something
33:58
so they take Leslie to their house and while they're at the house they do the normal thing and rapes the strangles
34:04
honestly and then they take her body out to the mortgage get buried there's a lot more to this it's just like why even
34:10
bother one of the details do they they bury them or do they just leave them no they bury them okay there's a lot more
34:16
detail but again like I just messages yes they took pictures of her yes she
34:22
screamed and they like all all the gross stuff you would imagine happened but it's like dude it happened like [ __ ]
34:28
20 times I'm not gonna keep talking about every single one of them so just use your imagination so two months later
34:33
came Edward Evans Ian asked Myra to take him to a railway station to look for a victim and Ian
34:40
ended up finding Edward who was 17 years old so he's a bigger human than these 10
34:46
year olds and 12 year olds are taking he's out of the chimney sweet business yep yep Rod shoulders so Ian apparently
34:54
told Edward that he was like this was a hookup like Ian was like I'm gay you're
34:59
gay this woman with me is my sister we live together she's gonna take us home
35:04
that's that was his conversation with Edward so Edward goes with them
35:09
I did not bring this up earlier but Myra's sister her I mean I brought up my resistor before her name is Maureen
35:15
Maureen was married to a guy named David Smith okay and David Smith Maureen and
35:20
Myra and Ian liberally close to each other for some reason David was also obsessed
35:27
with Ian and also thought he was the coolest guy in the world and also thought like all these great things about him again like this guy had like a
35:34
weird influence over people yeah that's weird and Ian Ian thought that he had a kindred
35:41
spirit and David when she did not he did not have a kindred spirit but he thought he did and so this night that
35:50
they bring Edward home David or um sorry Ian tells Myra to go over to Maureen and
35:57
David's house and to bring David over and to like tell him what to do so she does this she goes to David and says
36:02
come over David comes over but it's like staying outside of the house until I give you a signal then come knock on the
36:07
door I no idea why I I literally have no idea why this plan played out the way it
36:13
did it sounded incredibly over complicated and stupid so at some point they flicker the lights and David goes
36:19
and knocks on the door and then Ian opens the door and pretends like he doesn't really know him and says oh so
36:24
you're here to collect your wine again no idea why this plan this sounds like
36:30
such a stoner plan it's over complicated for no reason Dan plays along and then
36:36
Ian walks him into the kitchen and says Let me Go fetch your wine and leaves there in the kitchen
36:41
then David describes hearing some insane
36:46
screaming just over and over again like he sounds like a woman shrieking and he Myra rushes into the kitchen and says
36:53
David go help him out they really overestimated David's interest in what their lifestyle was David goes in and
37:00
sees that Eve is on top of Edward he's holding a hatch and just bludgeoning the [ __ ] out of Ian's face of this Hatchet
37:06
oh my God obviously after being blown in the head enough he's like sufficiently subdued so he enrolls him
37:13
over and strangles on the death with electrical cord while David is standing there he doesn't kill him yeah well then
37:19
he killed David no they killed Edward no but I mean like hitting you in the head with an accident kill him no no
37:25
apparently you had to strangle him yeah your school's pretty hard yeah it should only take a lot of damage
37:31
trust me so after all of this after all this
37:36
um David is like this was awesome and I'm so glad you invited me over I'm totally coming back later and helping
37:42
you dig up the [ __ ] grave to move this kid's body into Dave is like awesome loved it this is great I'm gonna
37:49
go home I'll come back tomorrow yeah that's like I don't know yeah that's that's weird like yes it might be
37:56
like a smidge surreal but like that's weird a little bit weird a little bit weird
38:01
what's not weird is what happened after which is David going home immediately telling Maureen what he just
38:06
witnessed vomiting like just rambling vomiting all
38:12
right that's a great events exactly again I was like I read this like why did Ian think David would be this
38:19
like chill dude and having a great time doing this it did not play out that way so
38:25
David the next morning he wait until the morning it was like 6 34 in the morning or 6 35 or so much like whatever he
38:30
hadn't called the police and told them hey I have a story to tell you all the police show up their house and pick him
38:36
up and take the police station where he basically confesses about everything what he just witnessed
38:41
finally yeah yeah exactly so the police would go to Ian and Myra's house and say
38:48
they need to look around oh wait I'm sorry stop I just got a news update from The New
38:53
York Times Ted Kaczynski just died no at 81. no way breaking news
39:04
thank you all right that's sad actually I know poor guy
39:11
honestly you just wanted his his spoiled milk he was given so much [ __ ] did you
39:18
ever watch my pretty faces go on to Hell the um the Unabomber episode no oh my
39:23
God they said they roasted Ted kaczyns it was so funny because it's Henry right
39:29
it's Henry zabroski and yeah it was oh so good um so anyways on hulich check it out
39:36
go back so the police showed the house and say they heard that a gun went off last night and they're just investing to
39:42
see what was going on they look around and Byron lets them in into the house
39:47
eventually they see that there's a door lock to the guest bedroom and the police were like where's the key to this we can
39:53
go inside this room that's where Edward's body was Myra's like the room the the key to the room is at my work
39:58
like cool we'll take you to your work Ian looks over arms like just give him the key like it's over like just give
40:04
him the key so she gives the key to the police find the body so obviously they Ian is arrested immediately Myra's not
40:10
arrested me like it took four days before police finally arrested her as an accessory to murder until he actually knew how involved she really was
40:17
once she was arrested police started finding these little artifacts that like serial killers tend to keep so they
40:24
found for example like a notebook with John kilbride's um name and information on there they found naked pictures that
40:31
they had taken with Leslie and they found audio recording of Leslie's torture and
40:37
yeah like police knew that these were missing kids so when they see the names it's like
40:43
what killing like with these are a pattern forming right because yeah
40:49
nobody knows what a serial killer is like this is like the 1960s like nobody know that's the concept doesn't exist
40:54
yet so please start talking to neighbors asking about Ian Amira and what they like to do
41:00
one of their neighbors mentioned that they would frequently go to this one specific site in the Moors and please start looking there and there they found
41:06
them arm protruding from the uh Moors from the dirt and that would have been Leslie Downey's arm the 10 year olds so
41:14
they keep digging they keep uncovering more bodies one thing they did that I kind of found interesting was that they
41:21
would oftentimes say pictures when they were in the Moors and they had a dog called puppet and this dog was like a
41:27
puppy at certain points and grew up police had a hard time knowing like when what timelines this all happened like
41:34
they knew that okay this kid went missing at this time there's a picture of them in the Moors at this time like what did they overlap they didn't know
41:41
so they had that basically applied General anesthetics this dog to like do some dating based on its teeth or gum
41:48
work or whatever to get a sense like how old the dog was to back pain yeah oh ultimately the anesthetic they
41:57
use ended up telling the dog they overdid it but whatever that's kind of one of the things that you end up doing a blast victim
42:03
so they uncovered a couple of these bodies no help from Ian or Meyer at all both of them pled not guilty and Ian was
42:11
ultimately found guilty of three of the murders and Myra was found guilty of two the murderers like they haven't found all the bodies yet they just like found
42:16
what they found and they started Prosecuting them so they're obviously sentenced to life in prison and during
42:22
this time police would start looking into other murders of children that happened or not missing children like
42:27
not murders but missing children that happened in around Manchester we don't know how many people these guys
42:36
so many more because they never confirmed other
42:42
murderers they would just kind of say oh God maybe we did that one I don't know right they
42:47
wanted to kill so many people yeah and she would tell them they're like hey if you take me on the Moors I could
42:53
probably find like I could probably guess like where a couple more bodies are and they would ultimately do this so
43:00
they ended up taking uh her body her uh taking Myra out into the Moors and they
43:06
just it was crazy like because they were so sure everybody was going to kill her they had like 200 cops with them they
43:11
had like helicopter protection they had like aircraft like anti-aircraft stuff it was crazy she
43:18
ended up not finding anything uh any of the bodies and so they're people were like this is a waste of time you should have done this so
43:25
Henry
43:30
what's his name Henry Lee Lucas Lucas yeah I just wanted to be out and get some free cigarettes yeah so Myra uh
43:39
ultimately would confess the murder of Pauline Reed that was the first girl I was 16 year old
43:45
um and she wasn't convicted of that one originally so after it's been convicted in life of jealous she finally confesses that police told Ian that Myra confessed
43:53
this he couldn't believe her and he said fine I'll confess to everything I've done if you give me the opportunity to
44:01
kill myself after so he was on what suicide train yeah I'm not gonna do that of course that was a no-go that wasn't
44:08
gonna happen you're crazy I really I just realized this Ian almost outlived Myra by 20
44:14
years the guy who wanted to off himself more than anybody else in human history
44:20
was almost 80 years old when he finally died naturally of Nashville that's crazy so
44:26
again like this is the point where Myra starts getting all this sympathy from people and
44:32
they think that like she was forced to do this with Ian Ian did not get any sympathy at all obviously he was a complete monster and was basically like
44:40
legally diagnosed as a psychopath that meant that he was moved from prison to a
44:45
psychiatric hospital so they they really don't do like the
44:50
psych stuff that we do here in the US over there apparently because once he's deemed uh
44:55
what's he's deemed insane in a psychopath he is not legally allowed to
45:01
refuse medical treatment for his mental health issues that's important because he she's trying
45:07
to kill himself because he because he's strong he starts to try and starve himself to death but legally he can't
45:14
because food is part of like his mental health treatment and so wow they force feed him so he starts petitioning the
45:19
government to deem him saying to go to prison so he can find other ways to kill
45:25
himself including starving himself to death he's not successful obviously in this he ended up dying uh and actually
45:32
pretty recently it was 2017 he was 39 years old wow yeah longest serving
45:37
prisoner in England's history wow yeah yeah uh again I'm gonna be annoyed at
45:43
Myra and her time in jail so she would file endless appeals and again with the sympathy people put on her so they
45:49
lobbied to get her life sentence reduced to 25 years which they did then later on
45:54
politics was like nah that's not long enough to do 30 years so they increase it to 30 years she lobbied herself to get her prison
46:02
classification reduced so that she could pursue a relationship with the warden of the prison
46:07
which she did so she got a classification from an a prisoner which lived the highest security to like a b person which is like less so they should
46:13
go on walks with the prison Warden and like have sexual a sexual relationship with her basically
46:19
and the one thing I'd say is like the only people that struck me is completely sane in this case were actually the
46:24
people who they victimized the parents of people they victimized so my sister Maureen ultimately would die before Myra
46:31
ended up dying and the parents of John kilbright attended the funeral attended Maureen's funeral just in case Myra
46:38
intended it so that they could strangle her and try to kill her and what's funny is somebody else was there that looked
46:45
kind of like Myra and the dad attacked and like sort of battering this poor woman who had nothing
46:51
and pineapples pulled off her but anyways that's that's basically the story she
46:57
ended up dying wow in 2005 I think it was I remember the exact date down but she was 16 years old so so crazy that
47:03
they lived to like see the internet and like 9 11. it was crazy you know
47:09
see all those gays start 9 11. Robertson so anyways uh again like
47:16
there's a lot of details to the story that's like God it's just so gross like it's so gross it's like why even isn't
47:22
it fun to talk about yeah you know like at least Jeffrey Dahmer stuff like it's fun to talk about some of that stuff but
47:27
with this like it's just like went to 10 year olds man yeah awful thing and like just and kind of like taking advantage
47:34
of the time I guess like no one really was paying attention you know or the kids could just
47:39
disappear or die in a chimney and you would never [ __ ] know
47:46
that's the story Taylor oh gross thank you for sharing as a future corpse um
47:52
and who is drinking hurdled milk what are you going to be discussing oh my God that's so gross I know I said it but I
47:58
still think it's gross okay so I'm gonna try to shake that off I'm gonna close out my windows where I was
48:03
Googling Moore's murders because I don't want to see their faces anymore Starks they are jerks
48:11
um that's the very least I can say about them they're just not good people no they're
48:17
badass they're baddies okay you're ready I'm ready I'm ready okay so
48:24
next Sunday June 18th is Father's day did you know that I've heard that call
48:30
your dad um so to prep for Father's Day I wanted
48:35
to celebrate a story about fathers and daughters um and so talk about the relationship
48:42
between Andrew and Lizzie Borden oh
48:49
um so you are first generation American
48:57
was Lizzy was Lizzie Borden a part of your life for me I was two when I came here so
49:02
like I mean I heard the whole like 30 whacks and all the like I I remember
49:07
buying a book dude it was called Liz Claiborne hold on
49:13
what's Liz Claiborne she's like a no Liz Claiborne is like a um a fashion
49:18
designer okay dumb confusing things because I do remember getting a book
49:24
and I thought it was about Lizzie Borden it was about somebody totally different and then
49:31
I'm messing up your story and derailing it no it's fine but like you've heard of
49:36
her you know um so you remember the rhyme which we'll say in a second um but just for me like it this scared
49:43
the [ __ ] out of me when I was little like it was I feel like it was in my life a lot um I
49:49
also like associate when I'm doing things with like the media that I'm consuming when
49:54
I'm doing it so like the kids bathroom I painted blue and it reminds me of Mount Everest because while I was painting the
50:01
bathroom blue I was watching about Everest documentary okay makes sense so I remember watching the Lizzie Borden
50:06
movie um it was like a lifetime not not the Lifetime movie the one from 1975 it was like a made for TV movie starring
50:12
um the woman from bewitch um yeah and I remember watching it and
50:18
being scared shitless and eating fettuccine alfredo with spinach noodles so whenever I think about fettuccine
50:24
alfredo I think about Lizzie Borden yes think about her a lot so we have to like you said do the rhyme
50:31
which is Lizzie Borden Took an Ax gave her mother 40 whacks when she saw what
50:36
she had done she gave her father 41. and you like skip rope to that yeah they died so people dedicated their
50:43
freaking lives to the story it is such a fascinating story that people have been like thinking about it forever
50:48
um and I there's a huge Lizzie Borden Society Forum which is like an old older
50:54
looking web form and people are active on it today people are active on it constantly it's all people
51:00
on it I watched the Elizabeth Montgomery movie from 1975. um there's a couple
51:06
other websites I went to there's a Lizzie Borden Society Forum something from a website called criminal element I
51:13
watched a show called history's mystery is a strange case of Lizzie Borden Lizzie Borden had an Ax from the Discovery Channel and I read a book
51:19
called The Trial Lizzie bordens there's a lot I mean there's endless endless stuff about this story
51:25
several of the documentaries were made like right after the OJ trial which is hilarious because they were trying to like equate famous American trials
51:31
together and one of them was like we imagine that Lizzie Borden spent her life with these murders hanging over her
51:37
head and that will happen to OJ and I'm like OJ is fine at all yeah he doesn't give a [ __ ] so
51:43
like so you know um but here are the facts
51:48
on August 2nd 1892 the Borden house is at 92 Second Street in Fall River
51:54
Massachusetts an uncle John Morse was visiting the bordens Morris ate breakfast served by
52:00
the maid Bridget with Andrew and Abby who are like the parents he left to visit friends around 8 48 a.m at 9am
52:08
Andrew went for a walk sometime between 9 and 10 30 a.m Abby went to tidy up the
52:13
guest room and was hit 19 times in the head with an ax
52:18
her body lay on the bed opposite to the door so you kind of had to be in the room to see where she was
52:24
at 10 30 Andrea returned and the front door was locked Bridget let him in and
52:29
then she went upstairs to take a nap because she wasn't feeling well Andrew sat down in the sitting room to
52:36
take a nap and he was murdered so violently that half of his head was gone and one eye
52:41
was totally exploded so he was like hack's death and that was some time after 10 30. at
52:48
11 10 Bridget and a neighbor heard Lizzy call come quick father's dead somebody came in and killed him
52:54
so that's like the stuff that we know for sure and then everything else we're not sure about
53:00
um so let me tell you about the people in the story so Lizzie's dad is Andrew Jackson Borden he was born in 1822 the
53:07
bordens were a Fall River like family they had lived there for Generations they were very very wealthy he didn't
53:14
have the nest eggs the egg that other bordens had but he did make his own fortune he was a carpenter he made
53:22
furniture and coffins then he was a bank manager and he ended up owning a bunch of property and he was pretty rich so in
53:27
today's money he had about 10 million dollars So yeah so yeah he had a good amount of money there's another Borden story
53:34
um that happened next door a few decades before where a mother who is like a great great aunt of Lizzie Eliza darling
53:41
board in through her chill through her three children into the basement well and then died by Suicide so they have
53:48
like another horrible story it's like right in the same neighborhood that happened before um so that's the dad um Lizzy's mom is
53:54
dead her name is Sarah Sarah Anthony Borden she was born in 1823 they had two children Emma and Lizzy and uh Sarah
54:01
died when Lizzy was two just like of being sick and being alive in the 800s so Andrew remarried Abby Borden she was
54:08
born in 1828. her maiden name is Abby Durfee gray so she was a
54:14
there's a lot of like spinsters in this story which means you're like 30 and not married you know so Abby was kind of a
54:20
spinster are they still called Spencer's no nobody uses the word spinster anymore oh
54:26
my God no you're not 100 years old no one uses the words to start
54:33
um so he probably just needed help with the family you know and so there was like an
54:39
unmarried woman and they were married it happened about when Lizzy was like five Durfee is also the name of one of the
54:45
banks that Andrew managed so it sounds like he like worked with her dad and then met her um initially she had a good relationship
54:50
with the girls they were young when and then she was in her 30s when they when she moved into the house eventually
54:57
closer to the time of the murders Lizzy would start calling her Mrs Borden instead of mother so they ended up kind of having a falling out
55:03
Emma the older sister was also unmarried and she was agoraphobic but during the murder she was out of town which is
55:09
weird because she like never left her house but she was out of town during the murders visiting friends so Lizzie herself Lizzie Andrew Borden
55:15
was born on July 19 1860. she was also unmarried she's 32 at the time of the
55:20
murders she taught Sunday school she was in the women's Temperance league and the ladies fruit and flower Mission like she
55:26
was bored you know yeah she was so [ __ ] bored a woman her age was
55:32
supposed to be spending her time taking care of her family you know only managing a household like that's really
55:37
the only option so she didn't have that option she really had nothing to do why would you just casually take up like
55:44
being part of a temperance movement like religious like you know so your only
55:51
favorite thing in your past something to do is just to kill everybody's Buzz so weird yeah I mean her life sounds
55:57
terrible and like she has her dad has a lot of money but they don't spend it which is like frustrating I think
56:03
probably for both girls because they're like you know we might as well be spending this money but they spend a
56:09
little bit so I'll tell you a little bit more about that but there's two other people who are in the um in the house at
56:14
the time so John Morris is the brother of Sarah who's Lizzie's birth mom and he came by to visit he came by
56:19
independently just like randomly and like stopped by so he stayed staying with the board ends but he leaves in the
56:25
morning to um go visit and he's staying in the guest room there's also Bridget
56:30
Sullivan she's 25 years old she was an Irish immigrant and they are so such a racist time so they um eventually I
56:37
don't even think about this down but they tried to blame the murders on like a random Portuguese person they're just like anyone who's like a different like
56:43
an other the Borden family calls Bridget Maggie because their last Irish maid was
56:48
named Maggie and they just don't want to bother learning a new name
56:53
which is ridiculous it's like maybe your dog the exact same thing yeah
56:59
oh my God so poor Bridget it's like this sucks and also like it's so hot and so
57:06
victorians everyone's wearing like long sleeves and it just sounds like really stuffy and kind of awful so I read so
57:12
much stuff about this but also uh the book that well I also listened to the last podcast obviously and the book that
57:17
they recommend is Bill James's popular crime which is so good um it's such a great book and it's he's very funny when he he talks through
57:24
different crimes and like tries to quantify who might have done it um but his facts are it's almost
57:29
impossible to see how Lizzie could have committed the crime and also it's very very difficult to
57:35
understand how anyone else could have committed the crime yeah I remember that yeah so the third fact that he has that
57:42
Lizzie made a number of statements about the case that were self-contradictory and in conflict with the testimony of
57:47
other persons so there's that that part is definitely true so
57:53
here's the scene and here's here's the day and what the kind of leading up to the day so we know the people we're in
57:59
Fall River Massachusetts which was once one of the biggest cities in Massachusetts rich people live up on a hill there's a hill where you live if
58:06
you're rich the bordens don't live there they could afford to live there but they don't they live in town so the house is
58:11
like on a main thoroughfare like in town it's Tuesday Morning lots of people are around it's not like an isolated place
58:18
Andrew was very very stingy the house had no water it had no gas lighting so
58:24
like those things were available but they had like kerosene lamps and they had like one water pump in the basement
58:29
and they had like an outhouse in the basement too I guess I'll get people like that yeah so when you hear about Warren
58:35
Buffett and it's like he still lives in the same house he bought for 500 000 like 90 years
58:41
this is such a big jump like modern convenience you know like how about you don't have to
58:47
be in a chamber pot in the middle of the night you know you could just not do that that's available to you
59:00
that's horrifying no no no no no so anyway it was an old house and they
59:05
could have done better but they have the girls actually have money they have like an allowance they get it from a rental house so Andrew owns a bunch of property
59:13
um he buys a house for his sister-in-law for Abby's sister and the girls are pissed because they want they want more money
59:18
um so the girls get the grandfather's house and the money from rent from that so they have a good amount of money eventually they're going to inherit the
59:24
money from their dad there's like really no reason to rush it but they so that's kind of where they are right now
59:29
something happened around like 1890 and that's when Lizzy started calling Abby Mrs Borden
59:34
um in 1890 also Lizzy traveled to Europe for a while with with other Borden cousins so she wasn't like trapped in in
59:42
Fall River Sheila got to go to Europe and like hang out so this is a [ __ ] lame though Taylor it wasn't like me and
59:47
you going to Europe they wanted to get pubs like hanging out and having a great time playing the Arts being locals like they weren't doing that they were like
59:53
repenting or something it had to have sucked no I bet they were doing what other the other half of our trip to
1:00:00
Europe would be like going to churches and museums yeah they put it back early
1:00:08
all the churches and museums in in Europe are nice dude I bet they would have thought they're the type of people
1:00:14
that would have thought English food is good oh 100 yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so
1:00:21
a couple other odd things happened leading up to the murders there was a fight between Andrew and Lizzy it's
1:00:27
presumed and she had some pigeons in the in the barn that she was keeping like as pets and he killed them so like maybe
1:00:34
with an ax also that could maybe not be true but he had like done this to her pets and she was super upset there's
1:00:40
also like you said rumors of incest but those come later and the reason that people say that is because like you know
1:00:46
he had his two older daughters living at home with him like he never allowed them or whatever reason they never went out and got married
1:00:52
um the crime was so brutal that it had to be personal you know like any forensic person would tell you that
1:00:58
also this is weird Andrew didn't wear a wedding ring but he did wear Lizzie's High School ring that she gave him
1:01:07
that's gross that's weird that's suspicious it definitely was doing something
1:01:15
um so that's that you know that could have that could could maybe or not have happened there's like so many things on Lizzie border Forum about it like
1:01:21
someone just had like a um a webinar about it so it's definitely still like something that fascinates people but
1:01:27
isn't this a point in time like it was common for for incest in the family I don't know I
1:01:34
don't know I don't know any more less than like now in certain areas I have no idea let
1:01:41
me have a more remote I mean look if you're in West Virginia like there's not much there's slum pagans is either
1:01:46
family or nothing but they're not remote they're in the middle of a city it's true okay you're right you're right but I don't know
1:01:52
um there's also some thefts in the house so someone had come and stolen some money
1:01:57
in A Streetcar tickets um it sounds like Lizzy was a suspect for those thefts so Andrew like dropped
1:02:03
the charges like didn't want the police to look into it so maybe she had done that but also like she's bored maybe maybe she did try to steal some extra
1:02:09
money or whatever so everybody in The Boarding House locked their doors all the time after this after this theft
1:02:16
and the house is really weird it is a house with no hallways all the rooms are
1:02:22
connected so when you walk in the front door there's stairs on the right and then there's two doors one door goes to
1:02:29
a parlor and another one goes to a sitting room so they're both kind of the same purpose just to like hang out and
1:02:36
then the sitting room goes to the kitchen and the kitchen and the sitting room both go to the dining room and then
1:02:42
there's a little back entryway and back stairs and the back stairs go up to the
1:02:47
third floor where Bridget lives and then also to Andrew and Abby's bedroom you can get there that way too okay I'll
1:02:54
send you a picture the other way to get to Andrew and Abby's bedroom is to the second floor so when you climb up the
1:02:59
stairs and on the second floor um there's the guest room where Abby's body was found that's one door one door
1:03:05
goes directly to Lizzie's bedroom and her room is connected to Emma's
1:03:10
bedroom yeah
1:03:16
always I don't know I was gonna look this up because I feel like when you go to like when you're in Europe and you go
1:03:22
to like Versailles there's no hallways you just like room to room to room you know yeah you're right
1:03:29
so I wonder when I was gonna look it up because I remember like when I was in Europe for the first time someone was telling me how they don't have closets
1:03:35
because they used to be charged by the room so you would have like a wardrobe
1:03:41
yeah like tax by the room but either way like also on the second floor
1:03:47
there's a big closed room they call it a closet but it's almost as big as Emma's bedroom it's a big room so it's a big
1:03:52
room where they like store all their clothes Emma's bedroom is a small room off of Lizzie's bedroom um and then Andrew and Abby have like a
1:03:58
bigger room in the back of the house so the only way to get to Andrew and Abby's room is through come going up the back
1:04:03
stairs or there's a door between their room and Lizzie's room but that one is always locked yeah and so what they do
1:04:10
is again like it's hot it's [ __ ] humid they're all wearing long sleeves like Andrew's wearing like a full suit
1:04:17
when he's killed and it's like 80 degrees and the house is stuffy like I when it's
1:04:22
hot and I don't have air conditioning I want the windows open you know like and
1:04:27
I want like air to be moving but air is not moving because every single door is always closed and most of the time they're locked
1:04:36
it sounds terrible sounds really stuffy I'm sure it smells terrible all that yeah
1:04:41
so the family had been also super sick leading up to the murders Lizzy had told
1:04:47
someone in town that she thought someone was trying to poison them because they had that bad milk but like also they had
1:04:54
no Refrigeration they were in they were eating old food they were eating old fish they were eating old mutton like a
1:05:02
mutton broth The 1975 movie does such a good job of showing how gross the broth was like actually they showed Bridget
1:05:08
like almost throwing up and then like they have the parents like it's so gross in my throat right now thinking about it but essentially like
1:05:15
during this time because of what the conveniences they had of their house and probably during all time like to keep
1:05:22
food from going bad you would keep it constantly cooking yeah Perpetual Perpetual stew or something right yeah
1:05:29
so they really stretched the fish in the mutton and so everybody was sick like it
1:05:34
was old Lizzy was not sick and that people saw that as being suspicious but
1:05:40
I also kind of feel like that's just smart um Taylor I looked this up forever ago and I'm gonna I'm trying to find it
1:05:47
again now but hold on where is it where is this I will have to edit one of those
1:05:53
balls okay so there's one there's a Perpetual stew
1:05:59
in Germany that has been around since the
1:06:06
15th century no yeah there's another there's another in
1:06:12
Japan that has had the same broth in their Perpetual stew since 1945. I hate
1:06:18
that anyways okay sorry exactly like in the Middle Ages looking up out there were Inns that had a big
1:06:25
pot of stew in the fire 24 hours a day seven days a week over time we added whatever you had and you never really
1:06:31
stopped adding to the pot like you should make it now you should not do that
1:06:37
um I mean no pardon now so anyway of course made them sick and so
1:06:43
Lizzy wasn't sick which people thought was suspicious but also I feel like she's probably just like I don't want to eat this I would not want to eat it she
1:06:49
has cookies or breakfast that morning that sounds a thousand times better than old mutants do you know this life sounds
1:06:54
so terrible it sounds terrible it's real boring and like dreary
1:07:00
um so Lizzy's not sick which makes people feel like she might have done it also a
1:07:05
pharmacist during the trial is going to testify that Lizzie tried to buy prussic acid to clean a seal skin Cape I looked
1:07:11
it up the Metropolitan Museum of Art actually has a sealed skin cape in their collection just like a short fur Cape
1:07:16
the acid could have been used like fumigation but maybe she did ask for it because she was bored but also it was
1:07:22
probably somebody else the it sounds like the um the pharmacist just wanted to like be in the news because later a
1:07:28
police officer's wife said that she was the one who went in and tried to buy prussic acid because you needed a prescription to buy it and they were
1:07:34
just kind of like doing like secret shopper trying to trick him so that probably isn't true
1:07:40
um Wikipedia told me that both girls were so mad at their father for whatever reason that they stayed at a hotel for a few days before the murders but I didn't
1:07:46
read that anywhere else so I don't know where that comes from and then we do know that Emma was out of town and which
1:07:52
was weird because she never left the house and then John was there the uncle and he never saw Lizzy like she came in
1:07:58
and didn't say hello he just left in the morning so they never even said hi so as in the morning of August 2nd as
1:08:05
the invents events unfold for the women Bridget is in and out of the house washing windows and she was
1:08:11
pissed she was pissed that Abby asked her to wash the windows it was hot she didn't want to do it she had food poisoning like she just didn't want to
1:08:16
do it but she was in and out of the house Lizzie is puttering around the house doing like normal Victorian lady
1:08:21
things she's ironing handkerchiefs she says that she goes to the barn to look for fishing lures for an upcoming trip
1:08:27
so they had like a small yard but they had a barn in the back so she's like rifling around Barn doing Victorian
1:08:33
stuff she also stays in the yard and eats four pairs and people are like
1:08:38
that's so weird why would she sit there and eat pairs while her parents are being murdered you know but I'm sure she was [ __ ] hungry and
1:08:44
it makes sense to eat a fresh pear rather than old stew that's the most exciting thing that's happened so far yeah
1:08:51
it sounds delicious and fresh and that sounds great so she's eating pears in
1:08:56
the backyard kind of hanging out it's hot as [ __ ] she's wearing long sleeves so Lizzy said that Abby got a note from
1:09:02
a friend that was sick and needed help this was evidence that people liked Abby she had a lot of friends so it's
1:09:07
possible that happened but there was never a note like no one ever found the note so they don't know so she was saying that Abby was out
1:09:13
so sometime in the morning around 9 30 Abby is killed so she's cleaning the
1:09:18
guest room she is axed in the head and Abby weighs 200 pounds she falls someone
1:09:24
would have [ __ ] heard it you know you would think but she falls someone would have heard her we stayed in the house
1:09:29
that's like this age in Columbus Ohio one time uh my family and you could like see the first floor through the second
1:09:36
floor like it was like the house was old you know I'm sure that like through the floor yeah like there was no like
1:09:42
insulation you know like I don't think that like like it would be you would not you wouldn't miss it if someone fell
1:09:48
yeah yeah everyone like dropped a book you wouldn't miss it right you know you would hear it Andrew comes home and he
1:09:55
can't get the door open so he's annoyed but like also all the doors are locked and he can't get it open and the doors locked and Maggie
1:10:01
um tries to get the door open not Maggie I'm sorry Bridget I wrote Maggie I'm doing it so Bridget trusted the door
1:10:09
open and she curses and she says that she heard Lizzy laughing on the stir on
1:10:15
the stairwell when she cursed so either she was laughing because of the bad word which is what uh Bridget thought but
1:10:22
also the spot that Lizzy was standing on the stairway was the only place where you could have seen Abby's body
1:10:27
because you had to be at a certain point on the stairway to kind of see like underneath the bed into the guest room
1:10:32
and this is the Abbey laying on the floor so that may or may not be true Bill James thinks it isn't true he thinks
1:10:38
that she didn't hear her laughing but like I don't know um Andrew takes a nap in the sitting room and the pictures he's sitting on
1:10:43
the couch with his head on the pillows and his feet off of the couch and his shoes are on so that's weird like do you
1:10:50
take a nap like that but also he's a lot taller than the couch so you wouldn't like see him cuddle up he wouldn't like be a cuddler but also
1:10:57
he's just like he's in a really weird position so I wonder if like he fell but but I don't know so George
1:11:05
I have here yeah so much about this case is based on like what normal humans
1:11:11
would be doing or wouldn't be doing or experience these people are like total
1:11:16
freaking weirdos right yeah is it really what I think that it's
1:11:21
weird if Andrew were to go to sleep in a full tuxedo at noon in 95 degree weather
1:11:27
probably not because he's a [ __ ] weirdo they're all weirdos that's true exactly yes like we don't know disease every day
1:11:35
I don't know like he very well might the group good point yeah do weird stuff
1:11:40
so Lizzy calls someone yells out someone's kills father babers start to
1:11:45
come Bridget goes to the Dr Bowen the family doctor to get him to come the police come and I'm sure you remember
1:11:50
this but the police is like the B Squad because everyone else is at like the county fair it's like the police it's
1:11:56
like the police day of fun and most of the police are out of town so they send the B Squad to uh to help I've never
1:12:02
seen anything like this and the you know this town is you know they're like dealing with
1:12:08
drunks and dealing with like Petty crimes they're not dealing with ax murderers for the most part so
1:12:14
also like the murderer could still be in the house like potentially they are because Lizzie's there like who knows so
1:12:20
people start coming in and out of the house the police do take pictures which is cool because that's pretty new it
1:12:26
wasn't a thing to take pictures of bodies but they don't take the pictures until about 3 P.M so it's been like five
1:12:31
hours since they died and they've definitely been touched and like moved around um but they take the pictures we have
1:12:38
those a neighbor Mrs Churchill finally asks where's Abby and Lindsay said oh she went out and then they go for
1:12:44
looking around for her and then they find Abby's body so they don't find it until after the police are already there this walls yeah
1:12:50
um so some other things that they find in the house there's a bucket full of bloody rags in the basement But Lizzy
1:12:56
says that they're from her period which they very well could be having your period is terrible it was terrible so
1:13:03
we also find an ax with a broken handle covered in Ash in the basement so they think that that may have been the murder
1:13:08
weapon but they're not they're not sure but also like there's no Footprints or handprints so
1:13:14
if you feel like if you asked someone to death you'd have blood on your like had to open the door so like so the
1:13:22
okay so that's the part of it where I'm just gonna say my piece of this is like I don't think she did it only because
1:13:28
I'm looking at the crime scene post dude this guy this guy's face was butchered
1:13:35
yeah absolutely gone like there's like the fact that there was no blood on her
1:13:42
in if she's like oh I was on my period
1:13:49
there's no way you would confuse like what what is your period like 50 gallons
1:13:54
of her face yeah it would be exactly so like so that's the only part where like I'm just like super in the Lizzie's
1:14:01
probably not guilty campus is because the blood yeah she's not there and it's I mean my
1:14:06
whole life without I thought she did it so this like this blows my mind because I feel like maybe she didn't because and because of that because she was so clean
1:14:14
um and also Bridget saw her between the murders and said she was clean so she
1:14:19
would have had to like clean herself off change and then do it again so yeah exactly right yeah it would have been
1:14:26
really really hard but I also just feel like anyone would have trailed blood like through that house and they would have had to leave the house covered in
1:14:32
blood so that and no one noticed on like the street so like maybe they were wearing
1:14:37
like black clothing you just couldn't tell or maybe they were the butcher already covered in blood you know stuff like that like it could have been but it
1:14:43
feels like someone should have saw something if another person had been there um they do the autopsies at the house
1:14:49
and they leave the bodies there so they leave the bodies there like overnight with with the girls
1:14:55
which is crazy um so the next few days the bodies do go to the morgue and then they get sent to Harvard and a man named Dr Edward
1:15:02
um performs another autopsy on them he takes the heads and boils them so he has just the skulls so they're buried up
1:15:09
without their heads and he has the skulls also Lizzy does something super suspicious she Burns a dress so she
1:15:16
probably did it in front of her sister and her friend and maybe in front of some other people but she was like oh you know we're just cleaning up the
1:15:22
house because also the thing I just thought about is who the [ __ ] cleaned up the blood probably poor Bridget right and so she has a dress and she's like oh
1:15:28
this old dress has paint on it people knew that she had a dress that had paint on it for real but she burned it in the
1:15:35
stove which was like normal you didn't really have the garbage men coming by so you would burn things but she didn't in front of her friends and they're like
1:15:41
that's the worst thing you could have done like now everybody knows you burned a dress like maybe it was covered in blood you know I don't know why she did
1:15:47
that why didn't she just do it when she was alone we just do in the middle [ __ ] night you know I mean what was your excuse she
1:15:53
was like oh did I paint on it and just I'm just like doing chores like normal chores
1:15:58
again again these are weirdos that's a weird thing to do but it could be totally normal for them exactly yes
1:16:04
super weird um so Lizzy doesn't act doesn't act like
1:16:10
you know again like they always say like you never know how you'll act in like an emergency but Lizzy acts like kind of suspicious the whole time but it's also
1:16:17
because Dr Bowen is giving her a [ __ ] ton of morphine she is high as [ __ ] she's like totally out of it um so she's
1:16:23
definitely confused also like there are thousands of people coming to Fall River to see the house
1:16:29
because they will forever like people are there right now staying the night it's a bed and breakfast like it's it's the same really oh yeah
1:16:36
I mean 100 me to go there everybody I have to go there yeah it sounds amazing so like there's like museums like the
1:16:43
whole town this is all this is it this is all Fall River has this is Lizzie Borden story and of course like if my
1:16:48
neighbor was murdered I would be over there right now I would definitely want to see a big looking at it you know
1:16:53
um also for the murders the border and sisters offer a five thousand dollar reward in the paper for the murderer so
1:16:59
this is also just like the OJ case like no one bothers to find the real [ __ ] murderer you know yeah you're like after
1:17:06
the person's acquitted they're like cool guess that's it you're like what you said you didn't do anything who the
1:17:11
[ __ ] did it so Lizzy was charged on August 8th 1892. she spent 11 months in
1:17:17
jail before her trial what are you looking at dude Taylor you can book
1:17:24
wait how much does it cost hold on oh my God you can Taylor you can stay in Andrew and Abby's
1:17:32
bedroom for 300 a night they didn't die there but that feels great no Abby did Abby died in her room
1:17:40
no she had a guest room damn okay wait hold on so let me see if you into the guest room no
1:17:47
you got Lizzy and Emma sweet yeah Bridget Jose John Morse
1:17:54
well John Moore stayed in the guest room yeah this is the silent part up Podcast
1:18:03
Lucy Borden house see our room so I'll have two 300 bucks it's like consistently 300 bucks that's crazy
1:18:12
is the guest room that's where Abby Borden was found 300 right Bridges through three people can see in
1:18:18
Bridget's room oh my God it's so funny hey would you you would say that right for sure
1:18:24
which room oh there's so many rooms in the third floor they don't talk about it's weird I would want to stay in Lizzy's room
1:18:30
even though it's not where everybody was murdered I want to say in the room that she lived in yeah I agree
1:18:35
but wow that's interesting that looking at this that there's like there's Bridget's room and there's also two
1:18:40
other bedrooms on the top floor so like who knows I don't know maybe someone could have
1:18:46
hit up there I don't know also I just wait did you scroll down it says no alcohol is permitted on the property
1:18:52
we have already had two fatal head injuries in the home that's funny yeah it's a Temperance
1:18:59
people but yeah I know that sounds awesome
1:19:08
okay cool anyway that's this is fun people should go there you can get a tour ghost tour that also has a ghost
1:19:15
hunt nightly from 10 a.m to midnight so for staying there you can part of the ghost hunt Okay anyway that sounds great we'll definitely do that so the trial
1:19:23
started on June 5th 1893 which is 130 years ago this week is when it started it was in Taunton Massachusetts it had
1:19:30
to be moved for like jury purposes um during the trial Lizzie was very quiet because she was like on all these
1:19:36
drugs she was chewing on her fan it was so hot um she did laugh at one point when there was like a funny witness talking about
1:19:43
dresses so she has feelings but most of the time she was just like really quiet the jury is all men of course there's a
1:19:49
picture of the jury that is on Wikipedia they all look the same it's like very bushy mustaches just like white dudes
1:19:56
um actually black black men could serve on juries since 1860 in Massachusetts
1:20:02
um but it was this one was all white men women didn't serve on juries until 1951. yeah
1:20:08
so but oh but oh but women were there women from all over brought food had
1:20:14
pickings outside tried to get and see it it was just like there were women all around just like of course there are you know like this is the most exciting
1:20:20
thing that ever happened they're gonna hang out around the courthouse um her lawyer was a former governor of Massachusetts he was very expensive but
1:20:27
very very worth it it was like a dream team they poised her as a good Christian woman who wouldn't do dream of doing
1:20:34
such a thing um one crazy thing that happened during the trial is they brought the heads the
1:20:39
skulls into the courtroom to show the brutality of the crime but they didn't tell Lizzy or her sister that they were
1:20:45
going to do that so Lizzy fainted right away it's kind of a fun day yeah a fun day at
1:20:51
court exactly a fun day at court um she also one point crying until she threw up so she does have like emotions and it's also really [ __ ] hot so
1:20:57
there's stuff happening um but the jury deliberated for an hour and a half and she was acquitted
1:21:02
so yeah real fast um after the trial Lizzie does move up
1:21:08
to the hill she buys a big house up there there's a summer bedroom and a winter bedroom there's 14 rooms there's
1:21:13
tiffany lamps she has servants she names it maplecroft and has a like a sign made out of concrete on the steps so she
1:21:20
lives in this like lavish house that she presumably always wanted to live in she changed her name to Elizabeth Borden I
1:21:27
don't know change the name to that um but nobody loves her like while she was in
1:21:34
the trial people were like on her side but afterwards like don't want to be associated with her so like her life was essentially ruined and she got the money
1:21:40
and she had to live in a nice house but she didn't have any like friends she didn't get to be a part of the like society that she'd wanted to be a part
1:21:46
of but she also never left Fall River she could have left but she didn't she want that again these are weird
1:21:52
people it's like they're just not fun or interesting I don't know I don't know and like that's also a good
1:21:58
point like if this hadn't happened we would never know anything about her and how many millions of people we know
1:22:04
nothing about billions of people because nothing extraordinary happened right but she had this extraordinary thing happen
1:22:09
whether or not she did it which is just I think crazy
1:22:17
in a row um what do you think hold on I'll get there so later in life she does become
1:22:24
like good friends with an actress from Boston named dance O'Neill or New York maybe but it's like a fan like an
1:22:29
actress and everybody's like it's same same with all time until right now where like being an actress was like
1:22:35
scandalous and so they think that she used to have Nance O'Neill like come over and have these big parties in the
1:22:41
town kind of frowned on that as well at some point Lizzy and Emma have a falling out and they don't speak for years
1:22:47
um in all of the films they stopped talking because Lizzie tells her that she did it and and I was like like the The 1975
1:22:54
film and so great like Emma is played by the grandma from who's the boss and
1:23:00
Lizzy comes home and Emma's like Lizzy you have to tell me did you do it and it just like Zooms in to Elizabeth
1:23:05
Montgomery's face and it's all her face is very moist the whole time because it's so hot and the camera pans around her and they sing the nursery rhyme
1:23:12
that's awesome and then in the end there's a Christina Ricci movie and that one it ends with her having a party and
1:23:17
being like Lizzy is Christina Ricci and she's like I she's having this party and
1:23:22
her sister is like what are you doing and it's hard there's there's music going off and Christina Ricci Whispers
1:23:28
to her sister or something and her sister's eyes go wide so she like confesses so the movies are all like she did I can't believe that Christina
1:23:37
there's also one with um Chloe 70 and uh Kristen Stewart that's very very gay I'll tell you more
1:23:43
about that theory in a minute too um the sisters Emma and Lizzy die within nine days of each other um they die in
1:23:50
their 60s Lizzie leaves the largest amount of money to the Fall River Animal Rescue League which I also was thinking
1:23:55
about when you said that about pets in Manchester in the 1960s or whatever because this is like the 1920s and they
1:24:02
have an Animal Rescue League in Fall River so there's like some of it um she used money and a trust to care
1:24:09
for her father's grave for all time and Lizzie is buried with her parents in Fall River so they're buried and like
1:24:14
all buried together um so yeah so was it her I don't know Bill
1:24:20
James her popular crime says no most people on the Lizzie Borden Forum think yes I'm not sure my whole life I thought
1:24:27
it was her and then this kind of blew my mind because it's like I feel like I thought about it a lot and and maybe she didn't do it she was mad at her dad
1:24:33
he was mean her life was boring maybe it was incest um because and then there was such a
1:24:39
violent crime because she was so upset about it um this is before the man from the trading
1:24:45
experters but it is right after Jack the Ripper so there is like violence in the news but he didn't use an ax like
1:24:50
somebody trying to think of like you know what was in there um could she have been gay and been and he
1:24:56
like found out and was super upset like some people think she was having an affair with a maid which I doubt but or
1:25:02
like she's the kind of girlfriend he found out and she's wanting to like live her life um but the big thing is like how could she have gotten clean
1:25:08
that seems almost impossible the only sort of while you were talking I was thinking the only way I could buy that
1:25:14
she did it was like there was a fit of rage it was not premeditated she cracked
1:25:19
them open and by some fluke of cosmic luck all the
1:25:27
blood splatter went everywhere with her that's the only way I can make it work yeah
1:25:33
yeah I mean that technically could happen this place like here's the possibility of this remember
1:25:39
Peter Curtin uh the vampire of yeah yeah so he would do all this friends where he
1:25:45
would be killing people out in the public and go home totally clean and and people would be like how is that even possible like he just like learned that
1:25:53
like if you stand a certain in a certain spot that the blood splatter would just like avoid you like whatever he like did
1:25:59
the math and figured out how to do it so like it's possible yeah yeah totally in
1:26:05
the Elizabeth Montgomery movie they have her do at naked and then she just like washes herself off afterwards but the
1:26:11
chances of that are really like low because I bet she was never naked like you know like ever like she probably
1:26:18
like washed her body parts separately out of a bowl you know like she didn't like nowadays we get naked all the time
1:26:24
let's take a shower but she never did that so I feel like she was probably like a Perpetual stew just perpetually
1:26:30
changing different parts of her body like never fully again so it would be weird that she would do that because also she's like very
1:26:36
modest food yeah so some other suspects are could it be a
1:26:41
stranger someone said that they heard someone come to the door in the morning and Abby let them in
1:26:47
um Andrew had a share of enemies he was like a bad landlord you know that bad but like mean so like you know whatever
1:26:54
they could have hide hid in that whole closet that whole closet was huge so they could have gone to that closet hid
1:26:59
and then killed um Andrew but then also where's the blood yeah just in fact there have to be Footprints and there
1:27:04
just weren't any which is so weird um later in life Lizzie had a nurse and the nurse said that
1:27:11
um she told them she confessed to the nurse that she had a boyfriend who had done it and hid in the closet and they had and
1:27:16
then he like ended up leaving her that was like what happened um a woman obviously this is crazy had a
1:27:23
dream that Emma came to her in her dream and said that she did it that she came into town killed her parents then went
1:27:28
back to visit friends um people think that the uncle might have done it his Alibi was perfect in
1:27:33
like a suspicious way which is like not fair because he had like a perfect Alibi um and then think that like also like it
1:27:39
could have been Bridget the maid she was mad obviously her life sucked but she was sick and she had to clean it up you
1:27:46
know either way she'd clean up I don't think she would do it um so yeah that's it we don't know we
1:27:52
don't know who did it it's a crazy mystery because the fact didn't really tell us anything
1:27:57
and just like OJ like she had acquainted but there was no like find the real killer figure out what really happened
1:28:03
the people were just like she probably did it but I got off because she was like a nice Christian woman and people couldn't believe that she had done it
1:28:09
OJ's the one who vowed that he would find the killer though oh great he could
1:28:14
just wake up and look at a mirror I don't think he's done much work on that no he's not out there investigating yeah
1:28:21
thank you fingerprints outside Nicole's house it's great it's interesting about like one crime to become so iconic like
1:28:28
it's a part of culture like this website's hilarious by the way like I don't know if you've gone on the Forum no I'm not on the Forum I'm on the
1:28:34
website for the house and it's so funny they even have like this section for like you can shop and they like have
1:28:41
this ghost called Lily the host to go stall and it is terrifying looking and it's like 100 oh God yeah
1:28:50
strike like Lizzie Borden is that a is that like a
1:28:57
Union shirt oh my God Miss Elizabeth Miss Elizabeth Miss Elizabeth's finishing school
1:29:03
turning girls into sharp young ladies wait where's the union shirt well it
1:29:09
says I strike like Lizzie Borden oh that's funny you know
1:29:15
um yeah I love these guys like if you look at the staff like they look like a fun group and they really
1:29:21
I mean they're doing a lot of they got a bloody ax for sale like this oh they look real fun yeah they do it was like
1:29:27
yeah you'd have a good time going to haunted house with them I love them I love them they're all dressed up yeah 100 I've got
1:29:33
Suzanne give you a peace sign I [ __ ] love it um yeah I love it I think it's it's super fun it's so it's just like a crazy
1:29:39
story and also this is like a far far fetch but I read the book Middle March a long time
1:29:46
ago which is a English novel written whatever a long time ago but one of the
1:29:52
things that um that it ends with a really like a line that reminded me of
1:29:59
this um I'm gonna read it but I don't know if it's gonna make a sense but
1:30:05
for the growing good of the world is partly dependent on unhistoric acts and the things that are not so ill with you
1:30:11
and me as they might have been is half owing to the number who lived Faithfully a hidden life and rests in unvisited
1:30:17
tombs meaning like if you just do good things and live a normal life no one will ever know but you're contributing
1:30:23
to the Future and like the subtle way that everyone does but when something crazy happens that's when you become
1:30:28
like a part of the it was like goes forever and that's what happened to Lizzy yeah it makes sense yeah so I'm sure her tomb is very
1:30:35
visited and I definitely want to go and I don't know it also like if is it
1:30:41
another [ __ ] random crime someone came to the house and asked murdered him yeah yeah the randomness of it right yeah
1:30:49
I don't know I yeah this is a this is a roller coaster
1:30:55
of an episode I know it started with celebrating the death of Pat Robertson and mourning the death of Ted Kaczynski
1:31:01
I know so much has happened in the past couple hours um
1:31:07
oh I'm watching that now I'm looking like a video of the boarded house
1:31:13
join us to stay play and for a hauntingly fun time I was a parking lot in the back now as a
1:31:19
bummer that the thing is gone oh you can buy a bloody ax that's a lot
1:31:24
yeah you could buy a bobble head brick dust file what does that mean I don't know I I tried it I clicked on the brick
1:31:30
dose I thought they'd have an explanation of it but they don't I have no idea yeah EMF detector
1:31:37
they are having fun a pen a coin for no reason a mug
1:31:44
a rise and grind coffee mug the cookie cutter is a pair oh no way I haven't gone there yet
1:31:50
that's awesome they're a Fun Bunch
1:31:56
yeah crazy and like you know oh it was a Christmas ornament that's all that's what I like to get when I go on vacation
1:32:01
I do Christmas ornaments to remember where I've been so I'll definitely get that when I go there yeah oh Liz on the doll don't love her
1:32:07
don't love it all Georgia from the ghost love him CBD coffee
1:32:13
cookie cutters up here anyway anyway how what a fun story I don't know it's fun
1:32:20
it's scary it's very of the time you know a a woman who has to
1:32:26
what a [ __ ] terrible life what a terrible life it's so important it sounds so boring
1:32:32
it's like um I would have killed them just for the excitement of telling someone what an exciting exciting thing
1:32:38
that happened that you have to live a life in a nice house and have actors over you know all of that all of that sounds good but her dad died soon anyway
1:32:44
he was like in his 60s so I don't I don't know I don't know such is life Taylor we are a little over
1:32:52
our time oh yes I gotta take a shower things I gotta go I don't know what I'm
1:32:59
gonna do with Joe I guess we'll go for a walk or something but oh my God hilarious we'll have a great time
1:33:04
I will and we are going to start some awesome advertising for the show here
1:33:10
shortly which will be really really exciting but we got like 10 more Instagram followers from me doing
1:33:17
Instagram ads there you go there you go things are happening now to being famous
1:33:22
again nobody who doesn't know us listens to this because nobody so it's friends only I don't know if
1:33:30
that's causation or correlation um that we've been asked twice email us
1:33:35
Doom developod or Gmail if you don't know us and listen but no one's done it so I think it's all friends I'm gonna
1:33:41
invent the new email address just about you please make me feel better um yeah please like And subscribe on all
1:33:49
of the things we're on Instagram Twitter YouTube Facebook at doomed to fail pod
1:33:56
you don't know me send me an email there it is awesome thank you
1:34:04
[Music]