Today we have the not-doomed story of Malala Yousafzai - who campaigned for girls to go to school in Pakistan when the Taliban was invading her area and demanding that women and girls stay inside and stop their education. Today, Malala's voice is a global cry for reform.
Today we have the not-doomed story of Malala Yousafzai - who campaigned for girls to go to school in Pakistan when the Taliban was invading her area and demanding that women and girls stay inside and stop their education. Today, Malala's voice is a global cry for reform.
Hi Friends! Our transcripts aren't perfect, but I wanted to make sure you had something - if you'd like an edited transcript, I'd be happy to prioritize one for you - please email doomedtofailpod@gmail.com - Thanks! - Taylor
Taylor: Spring is beautiful here. Everything's great. It's cool enough to not have the AC on
>> Taylor: In the matter of the people of State of California vs. Orenthal James Simpson, case number BA096. And so, my fellow Americans, ask not what your country can do for you.
>> Farz: And we are live and recording. Hello, Taylor. How are you?
>> Taylor: Good, how are you?
>> Farz: I'm good, I'm good. It is beautiful here. It is lovely. It is spring. The seeds are growing, plants are flourishing. Everything's great.
>> Taylor: I love it. We were in. I was just in North Carolina and the. There was like a quarter inch yellow pollen on everything. Like every single car was like covered in thing. There's a lot.
>> Farz: These bees are busy. That's a good thing. Although here in Texas I think it's mostly cedar that causes people to have allergies really bad. Yeah, yeah. As opposed to pollen. So we're fortunate in that, in that regard.
>> Taylor: Yeah. I'm. I'm like, well, knock on wood. I'm relatively okay with cedar. My mother in law isn't. And it's rough.
>> Farz: Yeah, yeah, it's. It was rough for me too. The first year I moved here. It was pretty rough for me actually.
>> Taylor: Yeah. Yeah. Oh my God. Hi everybody. Welcome to Dooms to Fail. We bring you historical disaster and failures and interesting stories. I'm Taylor, joined by Fars. And we are back because of spring break. Not as fun when you're old.
>> Farz: Definitely not. Although you find other fun
>> Taylor: you want whenever you want.
>> Farz: Yeah, it's true. But when the weather's really, really nice, it makes everything so much better.
>> Taylor: It does, it does. It is nice. It is nice. And it's nice here. I turned the air off. It's cool enough to not have the AC on. It's gonna get hot soon, so.
>> Farz: Good. Yeah, it's gonna get hot here too. That's the thing. You gotta like really embrace the moment because it's so fleeting.
>> Taylor: I know. There's not that many days in the year that aren't awful in many places.
>> Farz: Yeah, 100%. 100%.
Taylor: I need to do it again with my daughter Florence
So Taylor, I think you are gonna be telling us a story today.
>> Taylor: I am. I'm gonna redo so far as I just FYI, everyone recorded an episode with my daughter Florence and we need to. I need to do it again with her. She wasn't prepared and I did not prepare her. I guess I just thought she'd be better at it. But she wasn't. She's 11.
>> Farz: No, she was fine. She's 11. Like she, she's. She did what an 11 year old would do, which is fine.
>> Taylor: I'm gonna do it again with her. Just me and her. And we'll do something once we figure out a microphone situation, but it'll be fine.
>> Farz: For what it's worth, it was a good episode. I mean, the topic was great.
>> Taylor: Okay, well, I'm gonna do it again, tell you again, and then hopefully you'll have more stuff to talk about and then, yeah, then we'll hear from you. Wait, I'm ready. Okay. I'm gonna tell you about Malala. Cool.
>> Farz: Wait, so you're doing the same thing we did?
>> Taylor: Didn't you tell me to do the same thing again?
>> Farz: I. I did, But I thought you said you're gonna do that with her.
>> Taylor: I am, but I'm gonna do like a follow up. I feel like we went through this.
>> Farz: I know, I know, but then. Okay, sorry. Yes, yes. You confused me. That's all. Okay, go ahead. Sorry.
>> Taylor: I'm sorry. I'm like losing my mind today. I feel like. I don't know. I ordered 50 chicken McNuggets and four large fries for lunch because I'm like, I can't. All I can do right now is throw money at problems. Yeah, I can't do anything else. So we talked about Malala with Florence, but I'm going to retell you the story and then I will have a little check in with FL about it as well. But I feel like you and I talked a little bit more deep about, like, the Taliban and the Middle east and stuff, so we can do more of that while we're talking again.
>> Farz: Sweet.
>> Taylor: Cool, cool.
Malala was born at home because her family couldn't afford a doctor
So Malala is someone who was. Who fights to keep schools open and have help girls go to school because of something very bad that happened to her when she was 15 years old. So she's like a global. Like, everyone knows who she is, but let me tell you a little bit more about her background. So she was born on July 12, 1997. She's only 20 years old right now. She's from Pakistan. And I guess my notes are still kind of for an 11 year old. But just FYI, Pakistan is between Afghanistan and India. And there's always something going on between the countries there. Obviously in like the Middle east on the way to India. A lot of history that we have mentioned before and, like, we'll definitely continue to talk about it, but Malala and her family lived in the Swat district in the northwest of Pakistan. They're Sunni Muslims of the Pashtun ethnicity and in her hometown where she grew up. Because of their religion, like, it's very separated between men and women. Men pray separately and the women aren't encouraged to go to school, but they. They could, and Malala did, and she really enjoyed going to school. They. When Malala was born, like, a couple things that, like, it's hard to, like, when there's so many places in the world where boys and girls are separated, you know, that I feel like I don't realize as an American, doesn't. It's not religious. Like, in some places, I'm sure, like, in, like, you know, there's. There's dominations of Christians where boys and girls are always separated and men and women are separated. So it happens in, like, every religion, but it doesn't. I. I don't see it in my life. There's so many places where it's still a thing, you know?
>> Farz: Yeah, for sure.
>> Taylor: Like, I remember when I went to college, my grandma was, like, absolutely floored that I lived on the same apartment floor as boys.
>> Farz: I think it's more atypical or I think it's less typical the way we do it. Yeah.
>> Taylor: Yeah. But it's still, like, not gone, you know? Yeah, of course, that happens in, like, a lot of places. So when Malala was born, you know, she was born at home because her family couldn't afford a doctor, which, you know, really is probably pretty, like. But they are what a lot of people do in, like, areas where they don't have access to hospitals. Like, you know, you'll have a baby at home, which sounds freaking terrible. I know people who had babies, like, in America at home, and I'm like, go to the doctor.
>> Farz: Yeah, we solved this problem already. Why are you forcing this trouble on yourself?
>> Taylor: Like, some people I know, like, it happened by accident. Like, my friend Baron's wife had a baby in the bathroom. Like, she didn't mean to.
>> Farz: Yeah.
>> Taylor: Real fast. Some people, like, had a baby, like, at home and, like, ended up having to call 911 because, like, it happens so fast.
>> Farz: No, I just.
>> Taylor: No.
>> Farz: Yeah.
>> Taylor: Also, you also can get sent away from the hospital if you're, like, in labor. They can be like, you're not ready yet and make you go home. I'm like, both those things sound terrible.
>> Farz: How are you supposed to know when you're ready?
>> Taylor: You, like, start getting contractions. But then, like, you could. You could still. You could get tractions for days, even after your water breaks. It's not like you have to run there like in the movies. Yeah, but they make it seem that it is. It definitely isn't.
>> Farz: That's what I would have assumed, since I'm childless.
>> Taylor: That's what I Assumed until I had a child that, like, just. You just were. Your water breaks and the baby's coming in like four minutes, but it absolutely is not interesting.
>> Farz: Okay.
>> Taylor: A lot time to go, so. But. But because she was a girl, like, they didn't celebrate it. It was just like, okay, our first baby, the girl. Great, not great should.
>> Farz: You know, it's funny. You know, it's funny. After our last conversation, I thought more about what you said about that and it dawned on me because sometimes when we have these conversations, I like, while on it, after we talk about it, and I think I reached a conclusion on why they didn't want girls. I think it's because the family has to pay a dowry to boys to take the girls. And nobody wants to have to do that.
>> Taylor: Yeah. And you need to, like, keep your family going. And if a girl can't get a job, like, what are you gonna do, you know? Yeah, you want. You need to have a boy to get a job so that you can eventually stop working. Because otherwise your daughter, her only you have to. She has to get married and hopefully to someone rich. Because otherwise, or like, at least it won't often take care of you because they're gonna have to take care of you, you know?
>> Farz: Right, right.
>> Taylor: Yeah.
>> Farz: Yeah, that dawned on me. We talked.
>> Taylor: Yeah, yeah. Yep, that's definitely true.
Malala is named after a hero from a war that happened in the 1860s
So Malala is named after a. So the name Malala actually means grief stricken. She's named after a hero who's kind of a mythical hero from a war that happened in the 1860s. So also just like so much. So many, like, international wars that happened and like, I don't know anything about, but there was a. And a lot of it that I don't know enough about that maybe we should talk about in the future. We probably will. Is like all the stuff that, like, Great Britain did in Afghanistan and like Russia in Afghanistan and like all of that, like, I mean, Those are like 100 years apart, but like, always someone attacking that area, you know?
>> Farz: Yeah.
>> Taylor: And in the 1860s, it was great Britain. There was a war between Great Britain and Afghanistan, and the British were in India and they were attacking Afghanistan. And Malali, who is the person that Malala is named after? She was a nurse and she was like tending to the wound did because she couldn't fight. But her father, her fiance and her brother were fighting. And the legend is that when the Afghan were losing, she stood up with their flag and yelled, young love. You do not fall in the battle of Maiwand. My God, someone is saving you. As A symbol of shame, meaning, like, get off your butts and start fighting. And then they did, and then they won. But she died in that battle. The legend is that she died holding the flag. She was only 18 years old. So that person that Malala was named after is like a female hero in that area when there aren't very many. Her mom's name was Tor Pakai, and she stayed at home with the kids. Malala has a couple younger brothers. Her dad, Jaiden Yusufim, is a poet and a school owner. But it's very cool. So he had a school, and he let any kid come to it. Even if they couldn't pay, they were allowed to go. And Malala went. And she really loved being there. She wanted to be a doctor. So she's studying. She's still like a little kid. She's like 10. She's studying to be. Just to learn as much as she can. And then the Taliban starts to move into her area. So it's like a Taliban sect from Afghanistan coming into her part of Pakistan. And, like, they are, you know, overtaking the violence. They're fighting the Pakistani military and, like, the local police to take over her area. Is that what you understood, too? Yeah.
>> Farz: Yep.
>> Taylor: So they have a whole bunch of things that come with that. So, like, obviously it's very violent. They want women and girls to do nothing but stay home. So that includes, like, no school, school, no jobs. You can't go out shopping without a man, and that man has to be your relative. So, like, you, they basically don't want to see women out at all. You know, one thing that is. I mean, obviously all of that is shady, but the fact that there cannot be female doctors and that you cannot see a male doctor is just like, why not just kill a woman? You know?
>> Farz: Yeah.
>> Taylor: What are you doing? Like, that's just wild. So it's very scary for. For women in obviously during this time when, like, the Taliban is, like, coming in, trying to take over their area, and there's a lot of violence, like, in the street. And then it's obviously very scary to be a woman and a girl. But Malala still wants to go to school. And it is September 2008. She's 11 years old, and she is starting to speak up because her dad owns a school. People, like, ask him questions like, how are you feeling about what is happening? The global media kind of reaches out to him. And she did a speech in. In a. Like, that was, like, recorded and, like, put in the paper called, How Dare the Taliban Take Away my Basic right to education. So she's putting herself out there like as herself speaking about it. And she's a kid, so like, obviously her dad's helping her, but they're talking about this, which is dangerous, like a very obviously scary thing to do. So she starts to work, I mean work like volunteer for this Institute for War and Peace with Open Minds Pakistan. So it's like a youth program that they have and helps talk about how important education is. And she is, you know, just continuing to talk about it. But it's hard. Things are getting harder as it goes on in her area and people want to hear what's happening. So the BBC has a, like, obviously they have affiliates all over the world and the BBC Urdu. So Malala speaks Pashtu, Urdu, English and Arabic. And so the DBC in her area reached out to her dad to see if any students wanted to talk about it more globally, just tell people what was happening in the area, that they wanted to go to school, get support. And there was like a 15 year old girl who said she would do it, but her parents got afraid, of course, because there's like, like the actual military and police are being killed and their bodies are left in the streets. Like it's very dangerous. So the other girl backs out. And so Malala, she, she does it. So she uses a fake name, but it's kind of pretty clear that it's her because she's like the daughter of the, of the school owner. But the fake name she use, it uses, uses is Ghoul Makai, which is a name from a folk tale. And then this part I put in all caps and I didn't say when we recorded with Florence because get this. But it's basically exactly like Ender's Game, which you also don't get.
>> Farz: Yeah,
>> Taylor: I only saw it once, but I read it like three times. It's okay.
Malala is fighting to open a school for girls in Pakistan
So there's. So it's just like Ender's Game, where basically like in Ender's Game, they like invent the Internet kind of and like start talking about message boards and it's, it's so good. The kids. So she would do this. Malala in real life would do this by calling the BBC reporter on the phone and telling him, you know, what was going on. And then he would publish it as like her journal. It only went on for a few months, but it was enough that like, people started to see what was going on. And she said things like, you know, half the kids don't come to school anymore. A lot of her Friends have left town. So, like, it's hard to continue and to be excited about it when people. It's like a rebellious, scary thing to get your education, you know?
>> Farz: Yeah, I feel like I'd be one of the parents that would leave town.
>> Taylor: Yeah, no, totally. I feel like I don't. I wouldn't, I don't, I wouldn't.
>> Farz: It almost feels like her parents were somewhat negligent. The CPC should have taken her away from them.
>> Taylor: Well, I mean, like, it's her dad's like, life goal to be to have a school, you know, and like he wants to keep it open. And also their sort of income. So the whole bunch of things. Because they're going to go to a refugee camp, like, it's not going to. Not only they have place to go also.
>> Farz: Right.
>> Taylor: In a lot of, in a lot of these cases, like, there's no place to go and no way to get there. So you kind of have to try to figure it out where you are. So she. So now it's 2009 and the Taliban blew up and like totally destroyed over a hundred girls schools in Pakistan. So they're really just like burning it all down. They made a law that as of January 15, 2009, no girls could go to school. And people just are staying home because it's getting more and more dangerous. And then finally the military kind of pushes back about the school stuff, but it's too late. Like they've already blown up so many schools and nothing is going really well. So they're kind of going back and forth. There's some restrictions that are lifted, but not a lot. You can go to a co ed school, but you have to wear a full burka. So depending on like where you are, like, you can get education. But again, like at this point you're probably not going to because you're scared, which is part of the idea, you know, just to intimidate you. So you just don't go. And then you're not. And then you're not going to go. And then generations of women will go. So Malala's blog was read all over the world and she started doing a documentary with the New York Times while she was in a refugee camp in 2009. So her face is out there now. She was using that fake name, but now they know she isn't again. She's a little girl. She's like 12 at this point. And her family goes to a refugee camp. They finally go home in July. So now she's on tv. Sometimes people know who she is. She's nominated for some awards, like international. International Children's Peace Prize, a peace award for youth, things like that. But it's dangerous. And she's getting death threats, obviously, like, because they know who she is. And that comes directly from the Taliban and from other people who, who, you know, disagree with. With what she's doing. And something that she says, you know, she's. I mean, she seems very brave in many, many ways. But one of the. Some of the things that she says about this time when she thinks that they're going to kill her is basically like when they try. When they come for me, I'm going to tell them that I'm fighting for what's right. And I would fight for, even for their girls to go to school. Like, it's for everybody. It's not. It's not just for me and my very specific, you know, race and tribe and religion and blah, blah, blah. Like, everyone should go to school. And I would tell them that, like, before they killed me, you know, so. Which is pretty wild. She'd, like, I would double down. I wouldn't ask for anything. I would tell you I'm doing this. So she continues to speak out. And then something. The bad thing happens when she's 15. So on October 9, 2012, she's on a small bus coming home from school. So, like, it's not like. It's not like a mini bus like in America. It's like a truck with, like, seats in the back. You know, bus is, like, generous. So it's like a truck with seats in the back. It's a bunch of girls coming home from school. And a masked gunman stops the bus. And he gets on the bus and he says, who is Malala? And nobody answers. The kind of look at her, you know, as you would expect, as you would if that was happening. And he shoots her once in the head and then leaves. It hits her in her left eye and goes into her neck and shoulder. And the bullet is lodged, like, by her shoulder in her spine, which is crazy. Another two other girls were. Were wounded, but they were okay. But Malala was not okay. Obvious. It is a miracle that she didn't die. I cannot believe you could shoot someone in the head and not kill them.
>> Farz: Yeah, it's wild.
Malala was shot in the face on October 9; miraculously survived
It's wild. When I did the. The Jackal story, that's what happened to that guy, too. He got. Remember the guy in the bathroom? His first confirmed kill, he shot him in, like, the area between his nose and his, like, upper lip. And he lived and it's like, wow, that's your body's resilient.
>> Taylor: Yeah, it's pretty crazy that that can happen. So her brain was damaged. Obviously the bullet was lodged in her spinal cord. She had to open up her skull because her brain was swelling. And so they immediately got her into the hospital, but she needed to go to progressively better hospitals because she did a lot of care. So on October 11, so two days later, she went to a better hospital in Pakistan, but hospitals all over the world wanted to help. So October 15, she got flown to the UK on a plane that was donated from the UAE and she was still in a coma. So she gets shot on the 9th, she doesn't remember it happening. And she wakes up like a week later in the UK in a hospital, like, what the h*** happened? Is that wild? Yeah, she's like, she doesn't remember happening, doesn't know what's going on. So she's in a military hospital in Birmingham, England, and she comes out of a coma. Her family came there as well and they. Her family moved into an apartment and she did physical therapy mostly on her face. So, like, her brain was like swollen but then went back to normal sized brain and like, so she wasn't. Her brain wasn't damaged. It was just her. Her nerves inside of her face. So she'd been doing stuff for that. She. So the man who shot her is probably somewhere in Afghanistan still. It was like a bunch of people who worked together to. To find out where she was and identify her and shoot her. It wasn't just like one rogue man. It was like a Taliban sect. The person who ordered her to be shot, like officially was killed by the US military in 2018. Of all the people involved, only two went to prison. Was that terrible what happened?
>> Farz: No, I said that. No, I'm saying it's good that we killed the guy who ordered us.
>> Taylor: I know, I know. And two of them went to prison, but they were just released last year. So, like.
>> Farz: Well, yeah, because after we lost Afghanistan, we allowed the Taliban to take them over again. And. Yeah, that was great.
>> Taylor: I forgot that even happened. So much stuff happens. Yeah. So now Malala, she then, she lives in England. She goes to school in Birmingham. She goes to Oxford and graduates with honors. It's not easy, obviously, like, she's in a totally new culture. She's had to leave everything behind. She does get to go to school, but now she's on the global, global stage because she has been just this martyr figure, even though obviously she didn't die. So she Spoke at a bunch of different. She speaks at different summits. She speaks at the un she speaks at Harvard. She speaks at Oxford. She's met, you know, every, like, global world leader. And she, you know, her message really is like, you know, school is a right that everybody has, and you should be able to go to school, and we have the right to change our culture, and our culture says you can't, and things like that. So she started a fund called the Malala Fund that builds. Builds schools. So basically her job right now is she just wrote another book. She wrote a book called I Am Malala right after everything had happened, like, a couple years later. So she goes on speaking tours and raises money there. She. There's several girl schools, like, in her name. On her 18th birthday, she opened up a school in Lebanon for Syrian refugees. And she just, like, brings attention to these stories that we like. Just there's so much going on, we can't hear everything she had said at one point. Like, remember, she wanted to be a doctor. Then she was like, oh, I'll be a politician and, like, get stuff done. And now she's more like, I don't know. Politicians don't really get stuff done. I just think I can do more as, like, a private citizen talking about my. About my. My history. So she does that. July 12 is Malala Day from the UN like a global data, like, talk about her. And again, like, she says, like, you know, she got shot, but she is stronger because of it. And she wants education for. For everyone. And she has, like, a more global voice now, which I think is, like, shooting her had, like, the exact opposite effect. It made her a thousand times more famous and more recognizable and her cause would be more out there. So she won the Nobel Peace Prize when she was 17. She's the youngest person to win. She shared it with another person named Kalish Sadarti from India. She still lives in the uk. She is married. She got married to a man named ASR Mayak, who works with the Pakistani cricket teams and works for Advocates for Sports, things like that. So they really. They really, like, do a bunch of good stuff together. And she seems super happy.
A lot of her stuff is about, you know, just doing. Doing what you want to do
And a lot of her stuff is about, you know, just doing. Doing what you want to do and making sure that you, you know, are safe and are educated. One note, she's only been back to Pakistan a few times. Like, they banned her book there and called her traitor to Pakistan because she talks about how hard it is to live there in general. Like, without the Taliban with him. Without the Taliban and some people want her to take stronger stances and different things, but she's just sort of really focusing on her, like, agenda of education for. For everyone. Especially for young people, it is.
Florence: Two conspiracy theories about school for younger generations
>> Farz: So we had this banter, which I felt guilty to have with Florence on the call last time, about how, okay, this is, like, my conspiracy theory time. Okay, okay, okay. Two conspiracy theories. I'm gonna throw out there, one more for, like, our generational age and younger. I do think that the structures of schooling that we were taught to abide by were really there to, like, make us into, like, a version of, like, workers and employees and to not really think outside the box. You have to obey this and obey that. You know, this is what happened. This, like, it's very, like, I don't know. I don't. I don't. Like, I don't think being good at school is even remotely an indication of, like, how your life will turn out.
>> Taylor: No, I don't think so either. But, I mean, I think school is, like, obviously, I think it's important for a whole bunch of reasons. And I think, you know, like, they're trying to close our school, our kids school here. And a lot of people are like, well, if they close our school, homeschool. And, like, I want to homeschool at all for a thousand reasons. But, like, I think it's important for them to make friends and, like, see people and learn all sorts of things. But, like, I agree with you that, like, I don't think you're gonna figure out what you want to do for the rest of your life from third grade math. You know, like, you just need. That's, like, different. And then I think. I don't know what. Especially now, like, I don't know what school's gonna look like in 10 years. You know, like, what college is going to look like for my kids. And they're. It's going to be. It's not going to be like, our college. It's going to be different.
>> Farz: I think that if you were to redo the entire system, there's no way in h*** you'd end up in the place that we ended up here. Like, it's borderline malpractice and abuse. The fact that we, like, tell kids at 18, forgot what you're going to do for life, and then here's a $150,000 loan that you'll never be. You get a sociology degree, you're never going to pay that back for as long as you like. You know, like. Like, it's insane that we do that. And again, goes back to my conspiracy theory that it's just like, it's. It's meant to put you on a hamster wheel that you can get off when you turn 65, and that's not a great way to live.
>> Taylor: No, I think you're right. But I also think that if we did it again, we would do it exactly the same way because of all of the red tape and the bureaucracy. I don't know how we get around it.
>> Farz: That's probably true, too. That's why. True to second. Second conspiracy theory, which you just pointed out to what I think we'll actually get to what I think the end purpose of school is, which is to be around different people, learn different things, learn different ways of being, learn different. That's actually like learning your EQ skills on how to engage with people and get, you know, get. Get along with people. I think that's going to be one of the most valuable things.
With AI, why do you need to know anything ever, ever
Which also goes to the second conspiracy theory, which is like, with AI, why do you need to know anything ever, ever? Like, why do you need to learn any of it outside of how to be a human and what that dynamic is? Like, I don't know.
>> Taylor: But I don't know either. But I also feel like, I think we've talked about this before. Like, there are people that, like, don't learn anything. That, like, don't think critically or do anything. Like what you learn all the time. You talk to me once all the time about the stuff you're learning.
>> Farz: I like that in school, you know what I mean?
>> Taylor: But I need in life, you know? And like. But yeah, I didn't learn, like, I don't know. I don't. What did I learn in college? I don't know, but I had a great time and like, so I feel like there was better.
>> Farz: Yeah, well, that's the thing. I think what it's good for is teaching. Teaching that human element, but also teaching you how to think and want to learn things. I think that's where the main value is.
>> Taylor: Exactly, exactly. Because if you don't want to learn anything, then you're just like, I don't know, what are you doing? You're just like, existing.
>> Farz: Yeah.
>> Taylor: And like, there's so much stuff that, like, I don't know. And so much stuff that, like, I would love to know. And I learned new stuff all the freaking time. And I think it's fun. And like, I don't know. I feel like that's what I learned in school, that I, like, loved learning and, like, being in school, and I really like dances, and I like being with my friends and.
>> Farz: Yeah, Yeah, I hated being in school. I just like to socialize and mingle. That's. That was really what I was there for.
>> Taylor: Yeah, totally. And, like, I was. Heck, I was like, one of our friends. I was like, I can't believe that you're supposed to just, like, sit and learn calculus in class with people you're, like, having sex with. And they were like, what are you talking about? I was like, high school is crazy. Like, you're supposed to, like, just sit there.
>> Farz: Calculus was pretty advanced at my school, and so those kids were kind of nerdy, so there was no sex being had between them, I don't think. But the football team, I guess.
>> Taylor: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, I love school.
>> Farz: It is a. It is an interesting story. It's also a really good reminder that things are insane in those places in the world.
>> Taylor: And there's so many places where, like, people don't, like. I don't know, we just. I have so much stuff, and I feel very lucky.
>> Farz: I'm pretty sure the Taliban and Afghanistan are now at war with Pakistan again, so. Yeah, probably.
>> Taylor: I mean, they just are going to be firmer. Yeah.
>> Farz: Yeah. And it's all. Because it's, like, slightly different iterations of Islam and ways of living. It's like. It's not even, like. It's not, like, totally diametrical of those religions. It's like. Yeah, slight slivers are different here and there.
>> Taylor: Totally. It's like. I know you see that all the time. We're like, why, like, these two versions of white people are fighting? Like, there's just no reason to. Obviously, like, any. All of this is bananas, but all times are interesting.
>> Farz: All times are interesting. That is true. Which is also the name of a really good podcast called Interesting Times. Check it out. New York Times. Anyways, well, thank you for.
Mars: Artificial intelligence can take away your critical thinking abilities
So, Taylor, you're gonna do.
>> Taylor: I'll do a little. Yeah, exactly. A little.
>> Farz: A little.
>> Taylor: Just chat with Flo about school and about Malala and how she kind of feels about it, and we will do it together. And I will. I will post that separately.
>> Farz: Little compendium to this episode.
>> Taylor: Exactly, exactly.
>> Farz: So will that be the next release after this one?
>> Taylor: No, I'll just. Look, It'll be like 10 minutes.
>> Farz: Many release. Many release.
>> Taylor: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
>> Farz: Sweet. Okay. Well, do we actually, if. If. If you want to write to us talking about the conspiracy theories that I just threw out there or have any opinions or thoughts about Malala or school or schooling or the future of schooling. Write to us@dunefellpodgmail.com, find us on the social, which Taylor is diligently managing. But Taylor, do we have any list for mail?
>> Taylor: I do not. I feel like it's just been a while. If I like checked anything because I was in, I was on vacation and a little spring breaky, but let us know DM us on Instagram. I will answer and we'd love to hear your thoughts and your ideas. Yeah, especially the future of education. Like, what are we going to do? The answer can't be. Everyone gets super dumb.
>> Farz: It could be.
>> Taylor: Can it, can it be that I,
>> Farz: I feel it in myself when I, when I use AI? It does take something away from my own curiosity and critical thinking abilities.
>> Taylor: Okay, so that's the problem because, like, you could, if, if it's like, if it's just like telling you stuff, that's one thing, but if it's like taking away your desire to be more critical about it or to like, search for something else and like, I don't know, but also, like, I don't know how you're supposed to like, write anything or do everything if you only had access to like one library. Like, what do you. You can miss stuff, obviously.
>> Farz: Yeah. I think about in the context of me having discovered AI at like 39, 40 years old, you know, after having that much time of having to be forced to think of things and problem solve and do all that stuff. And if I can feel it happening to myself, I can't imagine what it's like if you're, if someone's having a kid, like born today or in like 10 years, like, what does that look like?
>> Taylor: Yeah. And that problem isn't like, they're not gonna recognize. At least you recognize it, you know, but they're not gonna know the difference.
>> Farz: Yeah, yeah. It's gonna be interesting. It's gonna be interesting. We'll see. Well, it plays out.
>> Taylor: Thanks everyone. Thanks, friends.
>> Farz: Please write to us. We would love to hear from you.
>> Taylor: Thanks, Mars.
>> Farz: Thanks, Taylor. I'm going to go ahead and cut off there.