We checked, and the bars at Charles de Gaulle open around 7am - which means the people who were killed in the collapse of Terminal 2E on May 23, 2004, were probably just annoyed to be there. Today, we'll dig into what brought on the collapse, from the French government to a history of concrete; it's a ride! Please let us know if you have ever once felt safe on a jet bridge.
We checked, and the bars at Charles de Gaulle open around 7am - which means the people who were killed in the collapse of Terminal 2E on May 23, 2004, were probably just annoyed to be there. Today, we'll dig into what brought on the collapse, from the French government to a history of concrete; it's a ride!
Please let us know if you have ever once felt safe on a jet bridge.
Doomed to Fail focuses on engineering disasters and failures
>> Taylor: In the matter of the people of State of California vs. Orenthal James Simpson, case number BA096.
>> Farz: And so, my fellow Americans and Taylor, we are back. We are live and we're recording. How are you doing today?
>> Taylor: Good.
>> Farz: Still good?
>> Taylor: Still good.
>> Farz: Not much deviation from last time to this time. We'll, we'll keep the banter alight then. Do you want to go ahead and introduce us?
>> Taylor: Yes. Hello, everyone. Welcome to Doomed to Fail. We bring you historical disasters and failures. And I am Taylor, joined by Fars.
>> Farz: I'm Fars. I'm here to tell you a tale. We have noticed pretty dramatic uptick when we talk about engineering disasters versus anything else. I think the true crime stuff is overly saturated at this point. And so I'm doing a little bit of a pivot over to the engineering side of things. I think y' all enjoy that. And if you do, tell me and if you don't, tell me@dubnifygmail.com. but that's what we're going to be digging into today, an engineering disaster. And I went, I did a side quest that I probably shouldn't have, but it just piqued my interest. So you're also going to learn a little bit about the French constitution today.
>> Taylor: Great.
>> Farz: Kind of like we're kind of all over the map, but it's, it's core. An engineering disaster. So as I said earlier, or inferred, it's going to be in France. We're basing this off of France. We're going to base it off of the events that happened at the third busiest airport in Europe, Charles de Gaulle Airport, which is just outside of France. I looked at the city it's actually in. It's got three words in it with hyphenations. And so I'm not even going to try and pronounce it. It's just outside of Paris. That's all you need to know from this airport.
>> Taylor: Yes.
>> Farz: Interesting. We thank you. Exactly.
Charles de Gaulle Airport was conceived in the 1960s
So before we get into the disaster, let's talk about the airport itself. But also it kind of touches a little bit on the French and their philosophy around design and the Frenchy way, the way that French people do things. That is more popping circumstance.
>> Taylor: Let's say there's some joke. Oh, about the French. D***. There's something really funny where they were like some, the dictionary I think had a thing that said, like here's things to begin with. One of the things was the French. And they did apologize, but it was just like the way that they said it. Like, you can't you can't say the French that way.
>> Farz: It sounds a little. But the reason I'm gonna start the story the way I'm gonna start it is because it, like, plays into, like, why they are the way they are. Like, I love you if you're French, but, like, y' all are a certain way, and it is reflected in your architecture and design, which is great. Yes. One of the most beautiful things in the world. So I kind of wanted to figure out, like, what was going on this airport, and so I kind of dig in a little bit of the history. So the airport itself was conceived in the 1960s, and there's a lot of events that led up to why this airport had a certain gravitas within the society of France, which is why they designed things the way they did and why that led to ultimately death and disaster. But let's get into it a little bit, so some background. I again learned way more about how the French constitution functions than I really wanted to. But I'm trying to lead up to, like, why this airport is the way it is for the 1960s, and I kind of went backwards a little bit. Basically, anytime there's, like, some huge political or social upheaval, the French just redraft their constitution. Like, it almost seems like the US Is unique in the sense that we don't really redraft it. We just add amendments, but other countries just, like, tear it up and redo the whole thing. This has happened five times since France has become a democracy, which means we are currently on the Fifth Republic of France.
>> Taylor: Fun.
>> Farz: Yeah, isn't it?
>> Taylor: I don't know that. Cool.
>> Farz: In case anybody cares, which sounds like Taylor might be one of them. The First Republic was right after. Yeah, clearly it was right after the monarchy was abolished, and that lasted for 12 years until a little guy named Napoleon declared himself Emperor, hence dissolving the constitution, which was no longer needed in a dictatorship. The Second Republic happened after Napoleon's exile and death, which we do have an episode about, and I don't remember the name of it, but you can go listen to it at some later date. That was when Napoleon's nephew, a guy named Louis Napoleon Bonaparte, established the next working constitution. So we're in the Second Republic. The Third Republic was from 1870 to 1940, and that one fell, obviously because of N*** occupation. Then you have the Fourth Republic, which is like the incident that led up to where we are today, which is why Charles de Gaulle Airport became what it became. So the Fourth Republic. That led to a ton of political instability. That lasted from 1946 or right after N*** occupation until 1958, when French military leaders who were stationed in Algeria, because back then Algeria was a part of France or it was colonized by France. And so in theory, it reported to French the French executive power. But the people there were in active revolt against French occupation. And the military leaders that were stationed in Algeria were like, these people in France are weak. They cannot control this. Like, this is not going to go good for us. And so we need to figure out a way to. To get rid of them, essentially. And this is a very, very long story. Like, I'm really just cutting to the chase here, but what they really wanted was just like a super strong leadership in. In Paris at the executive branch. And so they revolted in their own way against the government of Paris, which led to the ascension of a guy named Charles de Gaulle to leadership, to the presidency of France at that time. So. And that was when that Fourth Republic dissolved and Charles de All established the Fifth Republic, which is what we're currently living through. Makes sense.
>> Taylor: Charles de Gaulle was exiled to England during the war, right?
>> Farz: Yes, okay, yeah, he was. He was also in this, like, state of. They're gonna realize these guys are idiots, and I will eventually find my way back. Yeah, I could. We should do an episode on Charles Seagal, because this guy's a badass. Like, he seems like a hardcore dude. Like, he's really, like, he doesn't seem French at all. It was really interesting.
>> Taylor: Sorry, what a. What an indictment on the French that was.
>> Farz: We love the French. Your baguettes are incredible. So the story in France's history wasn't one of, like, deep pride, essentially because they surrender the Nazis, like, almost immediately there was like, national embarrassment after national embarrassment. This, like, colony in Algeria is about to, like, topple your, like, they actually thought they were going to go into France and topple its own government. Like, that's how bad things were. And so there was a lot of desire amongst the people for national pride. And a guy like Charles de Gaulle was the kind of guy who's going to bring them that national pride, essentially. That's what. That's what that. That background is part of that were these huge projects nationwide, like municipal projects, including a massive airport that could rival the biggest and the best in Europe, specifically Heathrow and Frankfurt. Those are the two kind of competing airports in Europe. So they tapped this architect, he was a young guy, he was in his 20s at that time, Paul Adreu. And from the very start of designing this single terminal Airport up until what it later would become, Paul was the lead architect of it. Apparently in this situation it was one entity that did everything. Like it wasn't subcontract contracted out. So you had the architect, the engineer, the designers, the builders, all kind of working under one umbrella, which is kind of unique. And I guess part of all that. Yeah.
>> Taylor: Who pay, who, who pays for an airport?
>> Farz: The state. In this case, the federal government.
>> Taylor: Got it. Yeah, because I learned, you know, like every city's station, train station is called Union Station.
>> Farz: Is that really true? Is everyone called that?
>> Taylor: Like most of them are? I was like, there's always like a Union Station. There's one in New York places. But that's because the train companies would get together and pay for it themselves. So it was like a united project by all of the different train companies because they were like, we, well, we wanted to be able to go here. So we're going to build this train station. So I was curious about how interesting.
The airport opened originally in 1974 with just one terminal
>> Farz: So in this case there's a thing called the apd, which is the Aeropostal Paris Authority or some department, some, some variation thereof. And that was founded as the committee to establish where we're going to put this airport in route funding. It was basically a bureaucratic organization to basically take money in, find people, give them money and then you get an airport at the end of it. That was the idea. So as I mentioned before, obviously, because this is France, as they're envisioning this airport, they're envisioning a lot of pomp and circumstance because this is a national pride thing. This is years of embarrassment on the national stage. And this is their return to kind of grace and glory. And Paul, this young 20 something year old architect, is the one in charge of all this design. The airport opened originally in 1974 with just one terminal. By the 1980s, that was kind of when widebody jets became more and more of a thing. And so the amount of space you would need for them was dramatically different. A single terminal. In this case, if you look up aerial photographs of the airport, there's like one wheel in the middle and that was like the first terminal. And that was good enough for what they had then, but it had to obviously expand beyond that to become kind of a European mega hub for airport traffic. Terminal 2 was the answer to that. So we're up to two terminals at this point. And eventually Terminal 2 would have expansions from 2A to 2G. So it became one of those terminals that had multiple prongs that came off the side of it. Terminal 2e was really meant to be like a huge statement. It was like it was also part of this national pride thing for the industry and for travelers, mostly because this was going to be Air France's like the, the, the flagship airlines terminal and it's a big deal. And it was also around the time that Air France joined the Sky Team alliance, which kind of show the world that they had that kind of Gravitas. And Terminal 2e was supposed to be kind of the central hub for all that to facilitate fast transfers of incredibly high volumes of international travelers. One thing that's interesting is apparently Charlesgall Airport. I thought it was number one or two, but it's like a top, most delayed, most missed flight airport to this day, which is not good.
>> Taylor: Yeah.
>> Farz: So Paul, the architect obviously wanted this new Terminal 2e specifically to be this design marvel. And if you look at pictures of it, the way I kind of looked at it and described it to myself was it looks like from the movie Event Horizon when they go to the umbilicus, remember that? And it's like, it's like this like oblong tubular thing and it just has windows all around it. It looks really cool. It looks really mid century, but like also modern and cool. It looks like what a spaceship would be designed in like the 70s and 80s.
>> Taylor: Yeah, really fun.
>> Farz: But that's basically it. It's like a tubular design and there's windows from the floor all the way above you in the ceiling. That's the idea. Structurally it was designed with curved precast concrete, which is going to be a sticking point for us later. Precast is just like not poured like they did. They do it somewhere else. They ship it in, basically. It also had a lattice of steel struts and a skin of glass over the whole thing. That was kind of the structural piece of it. The main piece of all that being that there was nothing that broke it up on the inside. There was no support beams, no support columns, nothing. It was all just wide open, empty space on the inside. Getting back to the concrete part we just talked about, again, the outer shell was not poured concrete, it was precast. So it was basically a concrete mold, like a curved concrete mold that was poured into place somewhere and then later on brought on site and assembled into this ultimate outside frame. That's actually a really good technique if the fabrication is done correctly. If it's not, and let's say you have rebars on the inside that are supposed to support the concrete if they're misplaced or the joints are Misplaced, then you don't know that because it's all inside. So you have this. You could potentially have an invisible flaw within the design of these precast concrete molds.
>> Taylor: Conceptual.
>> Farz: You would never know until it's too late, essentially. That's a little bit of a spoiler alert there, but something that's going to happen.
>> Taylor: Stop.
>> Farz: Who would have thought on this episode. So by the early 2000, it's just like a restaurant.
>> Taylor: Restaurant review. You're like, they've great restaurants in there and lots of wine. That's very nice.
>> Farz: Exactly. So by the early 2000s, construction had fallen behind for 2E. They rushed to finish this job, basically, and there were some issues on the safety side. One really fun fact that reminded me a lot of my own life was when they're going through the inspection phase, the builders are walking the safety people through it, and a giant, like, chandelier falls from the roof, like, right in front of the inspectors. Which also reminded me of when I was living at that lake house and I had a scorpion infestation. And the exterminators wouldn't believe me that I had a scorpion infestation. And so he meets me at the garage, and we're inside the garage and we're talking to each other, like, just like normal humans away from each other. And a scorpion. No, no joking. Falls right between us as we're talking. I was like, I keep telling you guys there's a problem. He's like, I've never seen that happen. This is exactly the same story.
>> Taylor: I had not heard that story. That's pretty great.
>> Farz: It was horrible.
>> Taylor: Oh, my God, you're so cool.
>> Farz: Yeah, I used to catch them in my master bedroom. They used to fall from the. The fixtures. The light fixtures. What?
>> Taylor: You live next to Lake Travis? Oh, in Texas. In Texas, yeah. Gross.
>> Farz: Yeah. Anyways, long story short, these guys failed their initial inspection, but they were given, like, a week to correct problems with fixtures, and they did that. And the thing opened in June of 23,003. So that's the timeline we're at. Eleven months later, on May 23, 2004, it's Pentecost Sunday, Which I actually didn't even know what that was until I researched it. But it's a religious holiday. It's 50 days after Easter, and for some reason, it's religious holiday, which actually worked out pretty well because it meant that very few people were actively traveling at that time. So good on that.
Four people were killed when a French airport ceiling collapsed in 2004
At around 7am There was a bunch of passengers that were in Terminal 2E at a gate and they would report hearing cracking sounds. They would report feeling like they were in an earthquake and they would report stuff just drifting down from the ceiling, like, just like dust coming down.
>> Taylor: You know what I hate? And I feel like you probably hate it too, but I hate being in that like thing between the plane and the airport. Yeah, it's always awesome that like terrifying moving tube of people. And like they always like you're like, hurry up and get in there. And you get in there and you're in another line and there's more people and you're like, we're just in a terrifying tube of people on our way to this plane. I hate it.
>> Farz: My biggest fear is on the way
>> Taylor: to another terrifying tube of people.
>> Farz: My biggest fear has always been when you're at the end of the jet bridge right where it connects to the plane and if you look at that thing, it looks like it's on a swivel. Like if there's a joint there, I'm like, if this thing like just decides to fail, like it's meant to swivel so there's something holding it in place. Structurally designed to stay in place. But if it does that, you fall like 30ft. Like it's like.
>> Taylor: Yeah. Onto cement.
>> Farz: It's really dangerous.
>> Taylor: Yeah. Oh, I hate them.
>> Farz: It happened to Jim and Carrie, a dumb and dumber, but he made it so whatever.
>> Taylor: He fell off the, the jet bridge.
>> Farz: You remember that. So we're just before 7am in 2004 when 100 foot length of the ceiling lost its shape and came crumbling down and four people were killed. Like I said it was a, it was, it was like it was in the 6am hour on a holiday. And so that it wasn't like a packed area, but four people did end up, end up getting killed. They were just sitting in the airport lounge, which is like the worst way to go. Like I hate travel anyways. If I die, man, that would p*** me off. So like you're getting a fun, not a fun. You're going to be getting like a new experience. Like if you die like in a plane crash, at least it's like, wow, I've never felt this sheer terror before in my life. Like at least like there's an experience to be had with that, right? But like if you just are sitting there waiting and you have like a Starbucks coffee in one hand and like you're reading your phone on the other hand and then like a ceiling collapse, like it's a, I don't know, it's not a good Way to go.
>> Taylor: Now, I would hope that you at least be, like, in the bar, like a couple Bloody Marys deep, and then go, yeah, 6:30.
>> Farz: Yeah, that's the right way to do it.
>> Taylor: Yeah, that's. That's. That's airport rules.
>> Farz: Airport. Airport rules. So France initiated an independent study of what could have potentially gone wrong. And this guy, Jean Berthier, he concluded in February 2005 that basically everything went wrong. So he didn't conclude that there was one fault with the structural design of this. Of this terminal. He basically said there was a little bit of weakness everywhere. And one thing I was reading a lot about was that we always talk about, like, safety margins. And essentially, if you're trying to create something that is just beautiful aesthetically, then it fits together in a way where, like, the safety margins can easily erode. And the whole point of the safety margins, because you assume they will erode, right? You assume that, like, maybe like the. The guy. This guy is going to pour the concrete a thousand miles away, might be drunk that morning. You assume that when they install it, maybe that guy, you know, like, had marriage problems.
>> Taylor: Like, cheesy stuff.
>> Farz: Exactly. And so. So it's cheesy stuff. Exactly. So some of the findings were the steel struts that supported the shell, they were embedded in the concrete, but they're embedded too deep. So they basically pierced the concrete instead of, like, holding it in place. That was obviously a problem. You don't want that to happen. The reinforcement inside the precast concrete was insufficient. So the rebar they put inside of it was badly positioned from the fabricators. And so it made the concrete structure itself weak overall, in general, that you're piercing it.
>> Taylor: How safe is concrete?
>> Farz: So we're going to talk about that.
>> Taylor: Okay, thank you. Yes, I'm ready.
>> Farz: There was a horizontal concrete beam that this whole shell kind of rested on, but that was weakened because the H Vac guy was like, there's no holes in this. So she Swiss cheese it with holes to make the H Vac work. The overall conclusion was basically that the whole thing had no margin for safety errors. And as a result, you have one big, massive flaw within the entire design system here. Then there was a question, like, what actually triggered it that day? And the details are that the day before or the week before the collapse happened, Paris was unusually warm for February. It was around 77 degrees.
>> Taylor: So many of you stories are that the weather is not as weird.
>> Farz: Well, usually the weather being like this wouldn't be a problem. It's the fact that you have all the other flaws here that you have to attribute to. So you have a week of unusually warm weather in February, about 77 degrees. Then the morning that this happens, the weather is like a 4 degree drop to 39 degrees.
>> Taylor: Right. So that's going to make like a change.
>> Farz: Yeah. So essentially what I said earlier, where the support beams were, instead of like supporting it, they were piercing the concrete beams. These things have been rubbing together in the wrong way this whole time since it was installed. But with the pressure differential, steel and concrete react differently than that. They say pressure, I meant this temperature, the temperature differential. Steel and concrete react differently to that. So one is going to go faster, slow than the other and then they're going to rub against each other even more violently and worse. And so that's also a big piece of this problem. So like I said, the hundred feet of structure collapsed, but that's actually not the whole terminal. Terminal 2E itself is about 2,000ft long. So the airport people, the authorities, they looked at this like, so what's the flaw? And the guy was like, everything. Like there is no one flaw.
The whole thing is flawed. Instead of using concrete, they used steel instead
The whole thing is flawed. Like, so we can't just go to one section to fix this one section. Like, no. And so they actually demolished the rest of the 1900ft of this terminal and reconstructed the whole thing. Instead of using concrete, they used steel. To your point earlier, they didn't use it originally because a lot more expensive. It would have caused more time delays and they were already behind schedule. But after this happened, they're like, let's just be extra super duper safe and go with steel. And so they did that to cost about $100 million essentially, additionally. Yeah, I mean, yeah, because they had to rebuild the whole thing. So eventually the, this, this thing dragged on for 14 years. I think it would have been like somewhere around 2018 is when this is actually settled. But ultimately the airport authority was found guilty of involuntary manslaughter. And according to French law, there's a cap on liabilities. And so the total punishment for this whole thing was €225,000.
>> Taylor: Paid to who?
>> Farz: Families. Yeah, yeah. Which isn't a lot when you kill four people. I mean, it's kind of cheap, actually. It's like 50 grand a person.
>> Taylor: Right, so.
>> Farz: But now Charles Gaul, Terminal 2E is still there. It, if you look at it, it's gorgeous, beautiful. It's very like mid century modern. It is incredibly reinforced because of everything that happened. Like I said, it's now built with steel instead of concrete. And one thing that Was also interesting was that because this airport authority was so focused on design and beauty and all that they actually outsourced or airports outsourced their own design to these folks. And so this guy Paul was also responsible for a ton of airport designs and terminal designs, other airports. And so I don't think they do that anymore after this. But, like, up until that point, they were well known as the people to go to for this kind of work, so.
>> Taylor: So that reminded me of today, as in big Bear. We talked about this earlier, and. Have you been to big Bear?
>> Farz: I don't think so.
>> Taylor: So it's like. It's like an hour and a half where I am in the desert. So it's like. And it's up, so it's cooler. It's like a lake on top of a mountain, and there's, like, really pretty trees. And, like, in the summer, you, like on the boat, and then in the winter, you can ski there. But all of the. A lot of the signs for, like, restaurants look like they've been burned. Like, they look like they've been through a fire. Like, they have the, like, black and, like, hard to see, and, like, it's weird. And I'm like, I don't understand what is happening. So we looked it up, and it's because of the extreme temperature changes and, like, the ice sitting on it. And then, you know, during. Even during the summer, like, the temperature can change 50 degrees between the morning and the night because of that. Plus the moisture, it just, like, oxidizes the plastic, and that's why they look like they're burned, you know, so there's just, like, so many, like, environmental things, especially with that, like, change of pressure and change of temperature. And also, like, Big bear is, like, 6,000ft in, like, elevation, so it's like the radiation's higher. Like, so many interesting things that you just, like, don't think about.
>> Farz: That's fun. I never went to big Bear. I used to go to Arrowhead. Is it Arrowhead?
>> Taylor: Yeah, probably lake Arrowhead and then Idlewild.
>> Farz: I used to love Idlewild.
>> Taylor: Idlewild is pretty awesome. Yeah.
>> Farz: But also one of those places where, like, sometimes you go up there and you'll never be able to get back down because maybe there'll be an avalanche
>> Taylor: and block the main forest fire, and then you can't get back down. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
>> Farz: I do love that kind of living, though. That'd be really fun.
>> Taylor: Yeah.
>> Farz: I feel like I'd be nice and burly for that, you know?
>> Taylor: Yes.
>> Farz: Go get, like, A flannel shirt and, like, an ax. I can cut my ahi tuna with it.
>> Taylor: Burliest thing you can do. Perfect.
So anyways, engineering disaster for y' all from Paris. No criticisms. We aim to please. We are here to. Very much
>> Farz: So anyways, engineering disaster for y' all from Paris. I. I kind of want to do an episode on Charles de Gaulle, because the more I read about this guy, the more I was like, he's really cool. I'm sure he's done horrible things, by the way, but in terms of, like, historical figures, he seems like a. Like a very interesting guy.
>> Taylor: Yeah, exactly. Very much. Like, who isn't terrible? But also. Yes, I'd love to learn more
>> Farz: if we figure that out. But if y' all want engineering disasters, more of them or you want bios, let us know at doom to call pot gmail.com. and we are here to aim to please. We are here to. We are here. We aim to please. I'll just put it that way.
>> Taylor: Yeah, it's better. No criticisms. Cool.
One of my friends was there when that happened at Charleston
I think the one thing I wanted to mention before we leave is I think my. One of my friends was there when that happened at Charleston.
>> Farz: No way.
>> Taylor: But I'm. I just. I've just messaged her because I want to verify that, but I remember that. I feel like she was there. I'm gonna find out.
>> Farz: That's incredible. Yeah, that's incredible. If she replies, let me know. But that might be. Actually be, like, an interview episode we could do.
>> Taylor: Yeah, yeah. Because I think. I think if. Feel like I remember her being there, and I just want to get that verified and then talk to you more about it.
>> Farz: So. Interesting. Okay.
>> Taylor: Because, like, remember our old CEO at our old job, and then the other, like, the. And the president and, like, her husband were at the airport in LA when there was a shooting, and they had to, like, walk out of it to a hotel.
>> Farz: Oh, my God. I do remember that now.
>> Taylor: You know? So, like, what do you do? Like, what does everyone else do when, like, something like that happens? Like, you know, do they stop the planes? Do they. Like, you know what? It doesn't just affect, like, the four people who died. It affects, like, the entire airport, plus the whole entire, like, ecosystem of the area. Because, like, then. Is your flight canceled? Do you need a hotel? How are you going to get out of the airport? Because it's not in Paris. It's, like, next to Paris. You have to, like, get there somehow. And, like, what's safe and, like, you know, why is it. Was it, like. Was it a terrorist attack? Was it something someone did? Like, what? You know, all the stuff that you don't know. Like, the first hours of a disaster. And yeah, that's interesting.
>> Farz: I think they were on like the Taxiway too or something when that happened. And they had like at the Taxiway or something. It was such an easy story.
>> Taylor: They couldn't get home even though they were like in la.
>> Farz: Yeah. Yeah. Wow. We've had some weird experiences, Taylor.
>> Taylor: Oh, man.
>> Farz: Do we have any lists in our mail?
>> Taylor: No.
Thank you to everyone who has mailed us thoughtful things
>> Farz: All right. Anything you want to lead off with chatting on people?
>> Taylor: No, please. Oh, we did get a new review on Apple podcast. So thank you. Let me find it. It was very nice and I really appreciate you and thank you to everyone who has done that. It's cool and helpful and sometimes I like see it places and I'm like, oh, that's cool. Like, someone said that they liked it. Skitty Paulie said, this is one of my favorite pods. Very well delivered in factual. Highly recommend. So thank you.
>> Farz: Thank you very much. Appreciate it. We'll make the same announcement we made at the last on the last episode. If you do want a sticker, write to us@dflpotage.com and Taylor will mail you some stickers.
>> Taylor: I will. I love mailing things.
>> Farz: She really does. I get mail. Taylor is the only person I've known in the past 30 years who mails me anything.
>> Taylor: It's true.
>> Farz: Just I'll just get something and it'll be like an envelope that's either peach colored or pink or light pastel green. I'm like, okay, this is Taylor. I don't even have to look at the from.
>> Taylor: Oh, my God. Wait, let me tell you something. This is really stupid. So I have your. I'm almost done with your birthday present, but I keep adding things to it and it's like in a box under my bed, right? Because I have. Under my bed, I have boxes for all, like the fall birthdays because I've already made everybody everything. You know, I'm on to Christmas decorations. Like, I'm doing the whole thing. But I pulled out the box of your stuff because I printed something for Rachel and I was wrapping it up and putting it in and then a spider crawled around the box and tried to get in the box. And I was like, no. And then Juan killed it. But I was like, could you imagine if I mailed you a live spider? Taylor sent me this really nice package for my birthday and it included a live spider. Oh, man, I killed it.
>> Farz: But that would have been really funny.
>> Taylor: But I was laughing. I was like, don't go in the box. I don't know what to do. If you go to the box I can't mail you to Fars.
>> Farz: Also very thoughtful things. You kill the spider instead of shipping it to me on brand. So cool.
>> Taylor: Thank you. Enjoy the Odyssey. Text me after.
>> Farz: I will, I will. And again. Find us on all the social, the dunflp gmail.com or on the socials@d pod. Write to us@dmail.com I'm going to go see the Odyssey. I will let everybody know how that is next time we record.
>> Taylor: Cool.
>> Farz: And let us know what you thought if you have seen it or not. Okay, that's all got. Thanks.
>> Taylor: Thanks.