Next up! We are in Manhattan for the ‘only in NY’ story of the murder of Stanford White by jealous husband Henry K. Thaw. Stanford White was a super successful architect and also absolutely a sexual predator. When the former object of his desire, Gibson Girl Evelyn Nesbit, marries a narcissistic billionaire White’s days are numbered. This is also the story of the several Madison Square Gardens, the very American thing of tearing down our buildings to match tastes, and the beginning of the National Register of Historic Places. Photos via the public domain & #midjourney Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doomedtofailpod/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/doomedtofailpod Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@doomedtofailpod Email: doomedtofailpod@gmail.com
Next up! We are in Manhattan for the ‘only in NY’ story of the murder of Stanford White by jealous husband Henry K. Thaw. Stanford White was a super successful architect and also absolutely a sexual predator. When the former object of his desire, Gibson Girl Evelyn Nesbit, marries a narcissistic billionaire White’s days are numbered.
This is also the story of the several Madison Square Gardens, the very American thing of tearing down our buildings to match tastes, and the beginning of the National Register of Historic Places.
Photos via the public domain & #midjourney
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doomedtofailpod/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/doomedtofailpod
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@doomedtofailpod
Email:
Hi Friends! Our transcripts aren't perfect, but I wanted to make sure you had something - if you'd like an edited transcript, I'd be happy to prioritize one for you - please email doomedtofailpod@gmail.com - Thanks! - Taylor
0:14
I can't believe it's been four days already and it's so good to see you it's interesting do you haven't changed or
0:20
moved at all since we last spoke four days ago I'm not gonna say that I'm not gonna be in the same position in like a
0:25
couple days because I'm here for a week so I'm probably gonna continue to sit on this bed there you go chill so I think
0:31
that's normal enough fair enough uh so welcome to Doom to fail the podcast will recover a historic and True Crime Story
0:38
that is red flag he is all get out uh today Taylor is going to be sharing her story with us which I'm very very
0:45
excited she is currently in New York drinking a
0:55
drinking a red stripe but but her theme drink is a Manhattan
1:00
it is so yeah as I said I'm in New York um I'm actually a little bit above New
1:06
York City I'm in Newburgh New York so I'm near Hyde Park like 45 minutes from where the Roosevelts are so I'm gonna go
1:12
there in a few days and I'm super excited I'm going to take photos and let you all know last night I was Googling
1:17
where Lorena Hitchcock is buried I'm gonna go visit her so let's just do that and I'll keep everybody posted I'm gonna put it
1:23
on Instagram um because that is another story that I covered a while ago but because I'm here in New York and I lived
1:29
in New York for 13 years so I'm excited to be back um and we're gonna go to the city later this week as well but I'm
1:35
going to tell a very very New York story and this is a story of the murder of the architect Stanford white in 1906 and he
1:42
was murdered at the theater on top of Madison Square Garden it's a dope story so also want to just
1:50
kind of put out a warning there's a lot of sexual assaults and spousal abuse in this story so it's like it's like a fun
1:56
only in New York story but also like there's a lot of bad stuff so just to let everybody know so it's like every story that I do got it yeah just FYI
2:03
um my source I did watch a movie called The girl in the red velvet swing starring Joan Joan Collins Joan Collins
2:10
can you picture her she's old now she's 90. she's an American Horror Story apocalypse yeah um but this movie is
2:17
like from the 50s and she looks the same like she's it's cute she can definitely tell that it's still her um she's like 90 years old still alive
2:23
but a lot of my sources was just just Wikipedia and like stuff that I already knew from like I remember learning about
2:28
this uh some of the architecture that we'll talk about in in college and things like that but um on the plane on
2:34
the way here I I told you to the red eye and I can't sleep on planes but I watched cocaine bear have you watched it
2:40
yet no is it good oh my God it's great I like really liked it so but at the very beginning of cooking bear it's it's
2:46
directed by um Elizabeth Banks who's so funny I just like such a good person personality of
2:53
y'all but um the very beginning of cooking bear it has like a a paragraph
2:59
about bears so it's like you know if a bear is attacking you you should fight back or whatever and then underneath it
3:05
and then it like pauses and then at the bottom it says Source Wikipedia and I laughed for like five minutes because I
3:10
was like this is so funny that's such a funny Elizabeth thinks jokes from Wikipedia I can just like imagine her laughing doing that so laugh out loud
3:18
it's a lot of this is on Wikipedia because I'm talking about some pretty famous buildings in New York and some pretty
3:24
tragic things that we did to buildings and I'm going to start with that cool um so have you been to Madison Square
3:30
Garden Farmers no um have you been to New York City I've been
3:36
twice okay I went for the US Open so really I just went from right like the
3:42
downtown area to Arthur Ashe yeah um cool well Madison Square Garden as
3:48
you probably know is where the next play basketball is played there I because I lived in New York for so long I saw a
3:53
bunch of things there I saw the circus there I saw Gwen Stefani there um I saw the Knicks I was in terrifying nosebleed seats when I saw them
4:00
um that's where I saw the Newark Liberty and I had floor seats and that was really cool um I graduated from college there so I
4:06
like my graduation at Madison Square Garden which was fun um it's fine I'm going to actually talk
4:12
[ __ ] about it later it's pretty ugly um Penn Station is the train station underneath it it's like a pretty ugly 60s monstrosity of a building and the
4:19
Madison Square Garden that we know today is actually the fourth Madison Square Garden
4:24
so I'm gonna tell you about all of them the first one um there was a space that was a railroad
4:29
station in 1871 in New York City on 26th and Madison Avenue and it was moved to
4:37
Grand Central Station and so that left this building that used to be a train station open
4:42
um and PT Barnum rented it and he changed it into the great Roman
4:48
Hippodrome which is fun and like ties back to the things because he made it oval and made it into a place where
4:53
there would be like races and he had his like circus [ __ ] there there was a band
4:59
leader who named it Gilmore's garden and had flower shows and Beauty contests music concerts the first it had walking
5:07
marathons in the Hippodrome part of it the first Westminster Kennel Dog show was there and I think it's still at
5:13
Madison Square Garden today that was in 1877. there was boxing before boxing was
5:18
legal so there were exhibitions instead of fights in 1879 of Vanderbilt named it
5:24
Madison Square Garden there were famous bike races in the Hippodrome PC Barnum came back with an elephant it didn't
5:31
have a roof so it was like really hot in the summer and really cold in the winter so it really wasn't going to work as
5:36
like a building to continue to do things in so it was kind of falling apart so that's the first one in 1889 a group of
5:42
like quintessential New York Rich guys JP Morgan Andrew Carnegie and Aster you
5:48
know bought it and spent half a million dollars building a new building in the same spot so the second Madison Square Garden is
5:55
where our story takes place when it was built it was the city's second tallest building
6:00
um it had a main hall which was the largest main hall in the world it had permanent seating for about 8 000 people
6:06
so it was like a pretty big space it had a 1200 seat theater on the roof and the
6:12
largest restaurant in the city and that was like the Roof Garden Cabaret the second MSG also had the 1924 Democratic
6:19
National Convention boxing matches the first indoor football games more dog shows it was a really a beautiful like
6:28
it's like a neoclassical building at the top of it there was a statue of the
6:33
Goddess Diana with a bow and arrow um and that was like pretty famous and it's in the museum now it was never a
6:38
financial success so it was torn down in 1926 and now it's the New York Life building and that one was um was made by
6:46
an architect Cass Gilbert who's pretty famous so that building is still there in that spot wait hold on what was torn
6:52
down then if the building is still there no the new building is still there the New York Life building is still there okay okay got it the second master
6:58
Square Garden is gone so like that building was only there for like 20 years or something when they tore
7:04
down the third Madison Square Garden was built on 8th Avenue between 49th and 58th which is closer to where it is
7:11
today um it also had the circus it had a lot of hockey it had the Stanley Cup finals were there there were dog shows but it
7:17
was kind of a shittyly built place to have events you couldn't really see from all the seats and I didn't have a lot of
7:23
ventilation and everybody's obviously smoking all the time so it was like really Smoky and like kind of weird in there but it also had some like really
7:30
cool events in it if a rally is for FDR Cleveland and Hoover it's a lot of presidential things in 1937 there was a
7:37
boycott Nazi Germany rally held there sponsored by the American Jewish Congress and the Jewish labor committee
7:43
the mayor LaGuardia who was the mayor was there so it was like a big event two years later there was a pro-nazi event
7:51
there by an organization called the German American booned and that was 20 000 people who were in support of the
7:57
Third Reich that was 1939. and you can see pictures of it there's
8:04
like Nazi Flags like in Madison Square Garden you know even though it's not the one we have now it's the third one but
8:09
still you know and the same place where like fgr had things so it's like yeah you just like have it there were
8:16
communist rallies F and on March 9th 1942 so it kind of goes back and forth It's like anti-nazi Nazi on the 40 on
8:23
1942 there was a mass memorial service for about two million Jews that had been murdered you know in in Europe by the
8:30
Nazis it was called the we will never die service and about 40 000 people attended so um that was like a big thing
8:37
that happened there was a rodeo um this is actually also the place where Marilyn Monroe sang Happy Birthday to
8:42
JFK which I'm sure you know you've seen oh yeah Mr President yep um Billy Graham had some things there
8:50
um so it was actually torn down in 1969. again this one was torn down it was also
8:55
pretty beautiful to build the new Madison Square Garden even though the new Madison Square Garden was not built
9:00
in the same spot they just tore it down anyway and it was a parking lot for 30 years um eventually in 1989 they built one
9:06
worldwide Plaza which is another building that's on that spot right now so the one we know today the actual best
9:12
world that you can see today is is where Penn Station used to be so the original
9:18
Penn Station was where it used to be it's on 8th Avenue between 31st and 33rd streets it's real ugly I know you looked
9:25
it up I think it's ugly the Penn Station below it is even uglier it's like pretty awful station below it the the train
9:31
station is below Madison Square Garden and it's like in the basement the actual so wait Penn Station isn't below it the
9:37
original Penn Station is below it that is abandoned right there's a train station underneath Madison Square Garden oh I didn't know
9:44
that okay I'm learning things yeah I'm not a newer guy like New York is like my
9:49
least favorite place in the world I hate going there and I hate being there and it's too busy and I know that people I know people have feelings about it I
9:55
know I know I'm the only one I know that I'm unique that I just have no ambition of learning more about it or
10:01
not learning more about it I'm interested in like the human history of it all but I just don't I'm not familiar
10:06
with like where's Penn Station where okay that's what I'm telling you first so okay so here's the tragedy and this
10:13
is what I learned in our art history degree so this is my hundred thousand dollars story to tell you is Penn
10:19
Station used to be there Penn Station was [ __ ] gorgeous it was completed in 1910 it was demolished in 1963 to build
10:27
this to build MSG it was built originally by McKim Mead and white which is Stanford White's firm we're gonna
10:32
talk about Stanford white in a minute um it had a beautiful facade it had huge like Gates it had columns and marble
10:40
inside was a huge open room and um on the ceilings were made of glass and there are these turrets made of iron it
10:46
was just like absolutely beautiful they wanted to build like a bigger a bigger
10:51
place and they needed like a new spot for trains so they tore it down and people didn't really believe they were going to do it until they actually did
10:57
it um in the New York Times the New York Times editorial board wrote quote until
11:03
the first blow fell no one was convinced that Penn Station would really be demolished or that New York would permit
11:09
this Monumental Act of vandalism against one of the largest and finest landmarks of its age and Roman Elegance it was
11:15
taken apart piece by piece some of the statues and columns were thrown into a swamp in New Jersey they just threw it
11:21
away these like beautiful this beautiful building they just threw it away why do they need to get rid of it in the first
11:27
place they just wanted to build up something bigger that could like hold more people and make more money and and do all of that so because the trains
11:35
weren't making as much money um as it used to so they needed to have like the venue as well oh okay you know
11:42
um you can still across the street from Madison Square Garden and the post office that still has that same look so you can see what like you can imagine
11:48
what it used to look like and you can obviously see photos because it wasn't taken down until the 60s
11:53
um so one good thing that came out of it because they literally just threw it away it was like beautiful building
11:59
um some of the pieces were like dug out of the swamp and like put in museums because that's how like beautifully they were they just threw it all away but
12:04
because of this we have the national register of historic places because after that people were like oh [ __ ] like
12:10
we can't just continue to tear things down in America you know this is a fourth of this building so now you can't destroy things like some beautiful
12:16
facades and some buildings are protected um when I was in Dallas um a few months ago like there were some
12:22
buildings or they're like building modern buildings but behind an old facade you know what I mean yeah which I
12:28
think is like which is like lovely keep the art update the building I get it it's like they're doing that
12:33
necessary of the Madison Square Gardens and the national register for historic places which actually is going to saves
12:39
like a ton of buildings which is which is great um but we're talking about the second one the one that have Outdoor Theater
12:44
because we're gonna go back and talk about the murder of Stanford White cool that was just like a side quest in
12:50
the Madison Square Garden love it so our three characters are Stanford white Evelyn Nesbitt and Henry K thaw
12:57
so Stanford white is an architect in like a highfalutin New York City Dandy guy he was born on
13:05
November 9th 1853. you can Google him now did you Google him stand for white because the
13:12
elephant in the room is his mustache and I want you to look at it everyone
13:17
pull over it's insane that uh it's a man he looks like Ned Flanders
13:23
uh yeah no he uh okay Netflix is a pretty good descriptor
13:28
um it looks like a broom like it's just huge and like very bushy it's uh yeah he definitely can have
13:37
breakfast for dinner yes exactly so if you look him up that's
13:43
like that's the distraction um in the movie he does not have that mustache actually I don't think you could even pull you can't even make it
13:48
no no it looks they they think you're faking it like yeah oh it'll say yeah
13:54
it's unbelievable um so Stanford white he designed Madison Square Garden the second one he designed
14:01
the arch in Washington Square Park very neoclassical um he wasn't officially trained in architecture but he toured
14:07
Europe and made some beautiful things made some Gatsby style mansions on Long Island like it's like the 1900s like
14:12
that kind of style he was married to a woman named Bessie spring Smith she was a socialite and
14:18
they had one son so he was Notorious like Playboy but specifically with young
14:23
women like two young women like way too young like young teenagers like not the
14:29
age of consent young um he had an apartment on 24th Street where he would bring women to like these
14:35
parties and like say women I mean girls like girls in these parties to get into it there was a secret entrance at the
14:41
back of an FAO Schwartz oh wow you know it's like really attracting young girls
14:46
um the top floor had a room and the room was painted like a garden so it had like Windows and there were like leagues
14:52
painted on the wall and the middle of the room was a red velvet swing that he would like have the girls swing on he would like push them on this thing but
15:00
that's where the medium of the movie comes in the girl in the red velvet swing it's actually it's really good so definitely recommend watching it but um
15:05
it definitely kind of romanticizes him as a person um he had a group of friends called the union club and they would do this
15:11
together they'd essentially get young girls get them drunk drug them and take advantage of them so definitely like a
15:17
predator yeah he would like give them money because he was rich so he would like pay for their stuff kind of be their
15:22
benefactor but like expect sex in a return and this is how he meets Evelyn Nesbitt so she's our second character so
15:28
Evelyn was born Florence Evelyn Nesbitt on Christmas Day and either 1884 1885 no
15:34
one sure in Pittsburgh her family was poor and her father died and her mother tried to make ends meet as a seamstress
15:39
so in the movie they really stressed her mom was like being around chorus girls because of the clothes but eventually
15:45
Evelyn like she does get into like the theater um and she moves through to New York when she's around like 14 15. so she's
15:51
like a model and a chorus girl whatever that means um she's sort of the quintessential Gibson girl do you know
15:57
what a Gibson girl is is it a flapper no it's like before Flappers um it's a there's a man named Charles
16:03
Dana Gibson and he was an artist and he would draw these women and it's like a hairstyle that like I try to do sometimes I'm gonna try to you like pull
16:10
your hair out so it's like big and like you know what I mean it's like it's like be like right kind of it's just like
16:17
it's like a little butt at the top and like your hair is really big and like it's a good Gibson girl it's like a 1910s like a 1900 like kind of kind of
16:24
um like sassy cute girl look um men wanted to take really good care of her um so she's cute she's sassy they liked
16:31
it she's still really young you know it's kind of style that she had um it's kind of implied that her mom
16:36
wasn't devastated with her being friends with men you know like they took they painted pictures of her naked when she
16:43
was like 14 15 you know very young and it was like bringing in money so the mom kind of let it happen
16:48
um and unfortunately you know that's part of the time too it's also again my family it's implied that my great Grandma may have like Lonesome of her
16:56
daughters out during the Depression it's just like we know what do you do it was a bad time but Evelyn was on the cover
17:02
of Vanity Fair and Cosmo like drawings of her some pictures of her um I want you to Google her also yeah I did you
17:09
did it so I think she was cute I know you won't think she's cute because you're picky and you don't have an eye for different time periods am I right I
17:15
definitely thought she was cute did you because I feel like usually you're like I like a very specific Modern Woman
17:21
she had no I mean she has like a I don't know how to describe it she has this like Regal Elegance look to her that's
17:29
like also sultry nice all right yeah yeah I mean you can tell she's a model like yeah she's obviously a model
17:35
totally so Evelyn and Stanford white meet and they have a relationship quote unquote you know what I mean like they
17:42
you know they he like gives her money and buys her things and all of that um he persuades her mom to go out of town
17:48
and it's like oh watch over to Evelyn great thanks you know so he takes her to his apartment with a swing
17:55
um it starts with them kind of like drinking champagne um he drugs her champagne and she wakes
18:01
up naked in a bed covered in blood because he had raped her and taken her virginity virginity is a social
18:07
construct which I think is like something to talk about later but it's still bad obviously because he raped her
18:12
while she was while she was um passed out they have a relationship for a while
18:17
whatever that means you know like in the movie it's actually quite sweet that they like are in love and he's like I
18:22
love you but I also love my wife I don't know what to do which he very well very well might have said to her you know like and said to these women but like I
18:28
can't leave my wife obviously also because like you're a child um but eventually eventually it does fade and he he sees other girls and they
18:35
kind of stop like whatever that was like I can't say dating whatever he he stops
18:40
she had a thing with John Barrymore of the Barrymore's um like the acting family um she meets him at Stanford White's
18:47
house and um he asks her to marry him and she says no they meet later in 1939
18:52
and he dramatically announces that she was a love of his life um which is super cute and she uh he's very handsome just
18:59
for the record John Barrymore so events eventually Evelyn marries a Pittsburgh rich guy named Henry kthaw and he's our
19:06
third person in the story um he is crazy he is just like not
19:12
together at all um he was born February 12 1871
19:17
Pittsburgh he's very rich he is one of 11 children but he's a weird kid he
19:23
would like have temper tantrums and like walk in a weird zigzag pattern he made everybody really really uncomfortable he
19:30
would talk like a baby to get what he wanted and he would do that even when he was a grown-up which is gross yeah
19:37
he's he kind of looks like if you look at looking at pictures of him like I can't pin him down he looks like a weird
19:43
guy like I don't know he's something special about him it's so hard to tell because like it's
19:48
just different times you know but I mean he looks like he could be in
19:54
Road to Perdition on the bad side yeah he doesn't look like a good guy he doesn't look like a good guy yeah
20:01
yeah so he um ends up going to Harvard because he's rich and it gets into Harvard you know
20:07
um but all he does is like play poker we get some fights with people all the time he causes a scene he would light
20:13
cigars with a hundred dollar bills you know just like being an [ __ ] um he was expelled from Harvard and it
20:18
didn't say exactly why but when he was expelled they were like you have to leave in three hours like in the [ __ ] out here it's like no one liked him they
20:25
couldn't even buy his way out of that um after his father died he was given an eight thousand dollar a month allowance
20:31
um today that's about 290 000 a month
20:37
so he just like had money to like throw away and he did um every time he did something wrong his
20:42
mom would clean it up with money he traveled to Europe um and he got in trouble for whipping a
20:47
Bellboy in London and he ended up giving that bell boy five thousand dollars to keep him quiet he went to like all the
20:54
brothels he threw huge parties and he would do things like as a Parting Gift you'd get like a diamond necklace you
21:00
know like he was just like dumb rich and didn't care yeah but he wants to be a part of society
21:05
like we've seen before with a bunch of these dudes and he moves to New York and he tries to get into all these different
21:13
clubs the Metropolitan Club the century Club the Knickerbocker club The Players Club there's like these are rich dude
21:18
clubs um even the Union League that white was a part of um but he doesn't get in specifically
21:24
for the Union League he didn't get in because he rode a horse up the steps and they were like this is embarrassing and
21:30
it's behavior unbefitting of a gentleman so he didn't get in um but he's convinced that white is a reason he's not allowed in any of these
21:37
and like he might as well he didn't have anything out for him but he surely was like that guy's weird you
21:43
know whatever but everybody felt that way because he was just weird like trying to get into things this was this
21:49
is that that social hierarchy thing where like being rich isn't enough you have to be like well quaffed and all
21:57
that so yeah he just didn't have the personality to like get in you know yeah everything else yeah
22:02
um so he at one point um he was mean to A Chorus girl and he
22:09
has a party and the chorus girl gets all the women who are supposed to go to the party to go to Stanford White's apartment instead so he's just like I
22:16
hate that [ __ ] guy he's like hate Stanford white so much um he's also obviously on drugs this whole time he's doing speed balls he's
22:23
drunk all the time like losing his mind um he meets Evelyn at one of these
22:28
parties and he's obsessed with her he starts like giving her compliments and gifts and being like why isn't this enough like why won't you marry me she
22:35
keeps turning him down you know obviously but he's just like can't figure out why she doesn't like him
22:40
he takes her to she gets sick she has an appendectomy and he takes care takes
22:45
care of her during this so he's like you owe me you know exactly and he takes her
22:51
to um to Europe and he and like Stanford
22:57
already told her she was like don't he was like don't hang out with this guy he's no good you know but he kind of sweeps in when she needs him he takes
23:03
her to Europe and um he presses her to tell her about what
23:09
happened with her and Stanford white so no matter how it happened he continues to be like he drugged you and raped you
23:16
he did these things to you and she's like he did and she like tells him what happened but she makes her tell him over
23:21
and over again he like is obsessed with this like idea of this like beautiful virginity and obsessed with the fact
23:27
that Stanford white did this to her and he like makes you talk about it all the time like relive the trauma over and
23:32
over again he can't stop thinking about it he it takes her all over Europe to like these like virgin martyrdom spots
23:39
to where Joan of Arc was born and he signs a guest book and said Joan of Arc would not have been a virgin if Stanford
23:45
White had been around wow he is over the top yeah so he's just like going nuts
23:51
um he gets her mom to leave and he keeps trying to get her to marry him and in the movie where they romanticized a lot
23:57
of this because it's like a 50s movie he takes her to the top of um oh the movie has a really great fake backgrounds
24:02
these are the top of like a mountain and like the Alps and he like asked her to marry him he's like is this about white
24:08
all these things he slaps her but he's like I love you just like very abusive and that's like the least of it because
24:14
in real life he took her to a castle and he locked her in a tower essentially for two weeks where he beat and raped her
24:20
just like going crazy and like screaming about Stanford white he's just like terrible so she's
24:26
being super abused by this guy and um eventually at one point like he
24:32
Stanford white like tries to get her away from him and sends her to a boarding school that's how young she is also during all of this she's still
24:38
really young um so she's definitely being abused and they end up getting married in 1905. so
24:44
Henry thought and Evelyn Elizabeth get married he like picked out her dress like you know all the things um he in the movie one of his goons says
24:52
to his mom well now your daughter has 40 million dollars and the mom says he couldn't have me for 41 million you know
24:58
like because I'm sure people were like oh God yeah you know it is weird how Stanford
25:05
white is starting to flip it's the good guy of the story I know it is weird because he he does feel like the good
25:11
guy even though he's a bad guy but in this case it's like two bad options
25:16
um so he continues to be obsessed um with with Stanford white
25:23
um he's worth like I said 40 million dollars which is about 1.5 billion dollars today
25:29
so on June 25th 1906 in route to Europe so they live in Pittsburgh they're going
25:34
to take a ship to Europe they stop in New York um with two goons and the four of them
25:40
go to the theater at Madison Square Garden so it's open outdoors and Stanford white is there so everyone's
25:46
probably a little nervous because they know that like those two are together they don't get along um thaw is kind of going crazy walking
25:52
back and forth doesn't know what to do they try to leave eventually during the finale of the show he goes up to him and
25:59
yells you ruin my wife and shoots him three times from two feet away and he dies instantly wow
26:05
um people go crazy it's the middle of the show you know other people start screaming and like running like to get out of the theater
26:13
um he might have said you ruined my life um but people heard him say you ruined my wife either way he like is just
26:19
obsessed with the fact that he had done this to Evelyn so he um so afterwards Evelyn says what did you
26:26
do and he said I saved your life um who knows what he means by that I kind of feel like he meant that he might have killed her eventually you know
26:33
he sounds like a unhinged Maniac he is an Unchained Maniac yep yeah so he's put
26:41
on trial um during the trial all this stuff comes out about Stanford white because no one knew like his friends knew you know but
26:48
no one knew like the things that he had done so like people at first they were like very sympathetic to be the fact
26:53
like oh he just got killed you know but then they start hearing these stories and the things that he had done one of the reporters at the trial was
27:00
Mark Twain yeah and he said quote everyone knew now
27:05
that white eagerly and diligently and ravenously and remorselessly was hunting
27:11
young girls to their destruction these facts have been well known in New York for many years but have never been openly proclaimed until now on the
27:17
witness stand and the hearing of a courtroom crowded with men the girl Evelyn has been told in a in the
27:23
minutest detail the history of White's pursuit of her even down to the particulars of his atrocious Victory
27:28
atrocious Victory a victory is particulars might well be said to be unprintable so now they know that he was
27:34
doing these things that doesn't make it all less crazy you know yes yes
27:40
um so the jury is deadlocked to have a second trial um he ends up being locked up for life in an insane asylum in Fishkill New York
27:47
the Matawan state hospital for the criminally insane which I am five miles from right now it's really close where I
27:53
am right now um he escaped at one point went to Canada he's still like getting money he's still Rich you know like he
27:59
eventually does get out and he they remained married for a while actually
28:05
um Evelyn got pregnant in 1910 she said it was during like a conjugal visit with him but they get divorced in 1915. he
28:13
gets out and lives to be 76. he just like this is like a rich kind of eccentric weird guy
28:18
um having having after having done this um she Evelyn marries a dance partner
28:24
Jack Clifford they travel around Europe she's kind of like a semi-successful chorus girl attraction burlesque girl
28:32
for the rest of her life eventually she moves to Los Angeles she's an advisor on the movie the girl in the red velvet
28:38
swing which must have been really traumatizing to like you know be there and like watch it happen again
28:44
um she has a stroke in the middle of filming at the age of 82 she dies a year later and Evelyn Nesbitt is buried in
28:50
the Holy Cross Cemetery in Culver City oh wow in L.A
28:57
um they had a their kid Russell
29:03
uh wow he lived till 1984.
29:08
yeah he was a selling film actor too um so wait this guy got out of jail
29:14
after killing somebody yeah guys if you're poor stop stop it
29:22
like go get money like get money and then commit crimes and then commit more crimes and then commit more crimes you
29:29
can get your money upon that screen scheme then commit crimes um I have one more thing um there's a New York Times article
29:35
written in 2007 called the girl the swing in a row house in Ruins Stanford White's apartment in the building it was
29:40
in was torn down in 2007 it was falling apart it had not been maintained um and
29:47
there the reporter I was watching get torn down and a man who lived on the street for 20 years he said
29:53
he had heard that an architect had lived there but he goes I didn't think about it I don't care much about pedophiles it
29:58
was just another old New York building there were Rats on the bottom and pigeons on the top well they turned down
30:04
and then also one more thing there's a cute YouTube video of Evelyn singing in like the 1930s about how she doesn't
30:09
have a man and she's really happy and you just feel real happy for her because you're like yeah I know men were
30:15
[ __ ] to you dude so yeah but um I love the Mark Twain piece it's like
30:21
history so amazing it'll just kind of overlap somehow I know I love it and like I feel like we've talked about PT
30:26
Barnum before we know what a hippodrome is like all the things that like it all comes full circle we know everything so
30:33
yeah sweet that was very cool uh I do like so the the historical part of it is
30:39
especially with a place like New York that is so historical and has so many stories in it is always really fascinating and now I know you know
30:47
what's funny is I thought MSG was actually a square no it's like a weird Circle yeah I mean
30:53
I looked up the pictures of while you were talking but for some reason I've always seen it like it's like a black box square like on one point
31:01
is it a Barclay Center maybe is that what I'm thinking of is that the one in Brooklyn I don't know what does Barclay
31:07
look like
31:12
that is in Brooklyn I don't know anything about New York no that's not it either you know what I
31:19
take you to New York sometimes well let's do let's let's have a tour stop in New York City I'll be real fun
31:25
I mean I typically go to DC like at least once every three months give or take and I think it's only a two-hour
31:31
train ride to New York from there yes so maybe maybe that should be the next trip
31:36
you may end up in Penn Station and you see how ugly it is there yeah there you go well Taylor thank you for sharing
31:43
especially a New York story while you're in New York um hopefully you get to enjoy that enjoy Hyde Park enjoy seeing the graves of uh
31:50
the Roosevelts oh my God I'm so excited I'm gonna try to I'll try to drive by this insane inside of them as well it's
31:56
still there um I think is still called the place for the criminally insane which is cool wait
32:01
still operational I think so what's it called um the
32:07
um massape Matawan Matawan state hospital for the criminally insane
32:15
and when When the Thought escapes he like walked out because he's Rich you know what I mean maybe it is it's a
32:20
medium security prison no it says was founded closed in 1977.
32:29
well what is it has six Google reviews how does something that closed such a fun place to host parties my
32:36
six-year-old never had more fun that makes no sense okay
32:41
yeah it's a it's part of the official Correctional Facility now yeah
32:47
it's pretty terrifying absolutely terrifying yeah old abandoned insane
32:52
asylums love it who doesn't who does it uh
32:58
yeah well oh I'm just sorry I had to have one more mail yes listener mail
33:04
um Kiara who's our first person who ever emailed us um emailed back and she was also in New
33:10
York recently and she was down at the One Trade Center and she was
33:16
um was taking photos and she saw this couple and this couple was like really really good looking like the girl was
33:22
dressed in like a 1940s dress and the man was dressed um in like a traditional Korean outfit
33:27
and she was like oh it looks so good she took a picture of them from afar and then she like went up to them and she was like you guys look so
33:33
good I just took a picture of you like by the sunset I sent it to you and she's like oh totally she took it but the woman who she took a picture of was
33:41
um Tyler Ryan's cousin I don't know who that is she's the daughter that Lori valo killed oh my God
33:48
I know is that crazy that's she just like happened to see this like woman he's like oh she looks
33:53
so pretty I take a picture and it happened to be Italian's cousin so how did she how did she know she she got her
33:59
Instagram to give her the picture that she took of her and then it was like on her Instagram was like oh my Justice For Justice for Tyler blah
34:05
blah that's wild that's so wild wow again an oak it all comes together I know it's
34:12
very exciting have you ever listen listen to our doomsday um punk episode about the uh The Valor murders those are
34:19
first was our first episode yeah yeah I think it was oh we come a long way Taylor we're so
34:26
close to being rich so excited to take you to New York City we're we are we are maybe like five
34:32
episodes away from being able to kill somebody and walk away from it
34:39
so wait we'll have fun Taylor everybody thank you we will see you in a week cool thanks
34:47
friends oh yeah [Music]